Border fence Options

[cmac]

for psycho and impala
Go!

[Psykopath]

LOL, thanks...

I'll make this short since I'm about to go train, but I'll jump back on it tonight.


The border fence they are constructing (ESPECIALLY because it has such massive gaps) is just a band-aid on a gushing wound. It looks good for a politician to support it and the simplified phrase "border fence" sounds nice and safe to ill-informed voters. If people want in this country illegally from our southern border, a sheet metal fence will not stop them.
The problem lies in their respective countries, not ours. They flood away from their corruption and poverty, seeking American ideals and the jobs that we don't want.

I'm not advocating tossing money towards Mexico, Guatemala, Honduras, etc. to "fix" their problems...it sure as fuck wouldn't. But I think a concerted, international effort to pressure their governments into action is long overdue. Don't just toss out a sound bite about it at a yearly press conference either. I mean really fucking pressure these assholes to clean up their respective acts.

And you want to see my somewhat general view on immigration?:
http://www.surfthechannel.com/info/televis...48366/S5E6.html

Oh Penn and Teller, I love your logic dearly. =)

This post has been edited by Psykopath: May 6 2008, 02:03 PM

[impala454]

Just two questions:

1. Which is easier to cross? Flat land, or a fence?

2. In an extremely general sense, do you ever think Mexico could/will become a more desireable country to live in than the United States?

[cmac]

that penn and teller thing was awesome.

[Testm0nkey]

just because mexico may never be as desirable a place to live in as the US doesnt mean the influx of immigrants won't trickle down with some improvement. by your own standards and statements impala, the US is far superior to Canada and while illegal canadian immigrants do exist, you can't say its even remotely close to the same problematic level/hype as mexican immigrants.

and i agree with zach - its not whats easier to cross "flat land or a fence", both are still very easy. these people risk their lives crossing deserts and walking for days sometimes to get here, a fence aint going to make them turn back

[Psykopath]

Just two questions:

1. Which is easier to cross? Flat land, or a fence?

2. In an extremely general sense, do you ever think Mexico could/will become a more desirable country to live in than the United States?

1.) Guess they'll have to find one of those massive gaps of flat land to cross...or just spend an extra 6 or so minutes on the IMPENETRABLE WALL OF AMURRRICA!!!

2.) ...Wow, talk about a loaded question.
I'll humor you. Yes, Mexico could become A desirable country to live in (in that classic "general" sense). Not "more so" though...I'm fond of my home country. I don't think we are, as a people, better than everyone else in the world. But much of what we do, possess, espouse, and namely preach is desirable to many others the world over. A lot of that can be seen as goals for a Democracy. Goals which other nations can use as examples to build on and adapt to their cultures, or what have you.
Anyways, the goal isn't to make Mexico into another America-lite, just fix it up to something more desirable to them.

[impala454]

1.) Guess they'll have to find one of those massive gaps of flat land to cross...or just spend an extra 6 or so minutes on the IMPENETRABLE WALL OF AMURRRICA!!!

Yeah... people out walking "just" have to go 50-100 miles the other way. No big deal. And the idea of a wall isn't to be impenetrable. Just a deterrent. Honestly, if they're going to break in, I'd rather it at the very least be the ones who have the drive and determination, and shred of ingenuity to defeat the deterrent.

2.) ...Wow, talk about a loaded question.
I'll humor you. Yes, Mexico could become A desirable country to live in (in that classic "general" sense). Not "more so" though...I'm fond of my home country. I don't think we are, as a people, better than everyone else in the world. But much of what we do, possess, espouse, and namely preach is desirable to many others the world over. A lot of that can be seen as goals for a Democracy. Goals which other nations can use as examples to build on and adapt to their cultures, or what have you.
Anyways, the goal isn't to make Mexico into another America-lite, just fix it up to something more desirable to them.

Hey man do I ever ask a question that's not loaded? I'm sure Mexico could become a more desirable place to live. But I highly doubt (short of some massive attack/natural disaster/etc) it would ever be enough to even slow down, much less reverse the flow of immigrants.

IMHO, there's no real way to round up 13 million people and send them anywhere. I don't believe they should all just get a free pass though. Perhaps some type of guarantee that they can receive proper paperwork (not citizenship) to be legally here, but that they have to work, limit the amount of children they're allowed to have, the amount of money they're allowed to send out of the country, and allow them to eventually go through the expense and process of becoming citizens.

The main thing though is securing the border in some way. If we just have open borders and anyone who wants can come in, the problem just gets worse.

[Testm0nkey]

as an american citizen we are allowed to send however much money out of the country to family elsewhere. i dont get that argument in the anti-immigrant campaign. are these low wage labor workers sending their secret millions to anti-american terrorist cells in Chiapas or something?

im reeeeeeeeeeally looking forward to my mexico city trip if i get enough vacation time

[impala454]

as an american citizen we are allowed to send however much money out of the country to family elsewhere.

they aren't american citizens.

[Oasis]

LOL, thanks...

I'll make this short since I'm about to go train, but I'll jump back on it tonight.
The border fence they are constructing (ESPECIALLY because it has such massive gaps) is just a band-aid on a gushing wound. It looks good for a politician to support it and the simplified phrase "border fence" sounds nice and safe to ill-informed voters. If people want in this country illegally from our southern border, a sheet metal fence will not stop them.
The problem lies in their respective countries, not ours. They flood away from their corruption and poverty, seeking American ideals and the jobs that we don't want.

I'm not advocating tossing money towards Mexico, Guatemala, Honduras, etc. to "fix" their problems...it sure as fuck wouldn't. But I think a concerted, international effort to pressure their governments into action is long overdue. Don't just toss out a sound bite about it at a yearly press conference either. I mean really fucking pressure these assholes to clean up their respective acts.

This

A border fence is about as useless as a deadbolt as a home security system. If someone wants to break into your house, a $25 Quiklock deadbolt isn't gonna stop him. Same with a fence. Nothing more than a cosmetic thing to give you a false sense of security

Much like home security, homeland security could be successful with one of two things - a big fucking moat with alligators, or guns.

[theIncredibleEdi...]

This

A border fence is about as useless as a deadbolt as a home security system. If someone wants to break into your house, a $25 Quiklock deadbolt isn't gonna stop him. Same with a fence. Nothing more than a cosmetic thing to give you a false sense of security

Much like home security, homeland security could be successful with one of two things - a big fucking moat with alligators, or guns.

I say a moat of acid......that way they're all, "oooh!! agua! refresco!" (or whatever the fuck they say)
and then they dive in and BURN ALIVE!!!!

[impala454]

This

A border fence is about as useless as a deadbolt as a home security system. If someone wants to break into your house, a $25 Quiklock deadbolt isn't gonna stop him. Same with a fence. Nothing more than a cosmetic thing to give you a false sense of security

Much like home security, homeland security could be successful with one of two things - a big fucking moat with alligators, or guns.

yeah but you still have the deadbolt. same deal as I said before, keyword "deterrent" not "impenetrable".

[FORSAKENR320]

i think a Phaylanx unit every 1000 yds (i believe thats the range) should suffice


put up a warning sign "i told you to stay the fuck off out land" next step, you get sawed in half by a motorized gun that don't give no fuck you're holding a baby, or pregnant.

[impala454]

sounds good to me... although not sure how much those cost....

2000 miles * 1760 yd/mi * 1 gun/1000 yd = 3,520 guns. prob still cheaper than the fence

[cmac]

it's sad that i believe you are serious.