Are we slowly becoming Great Britain? Options

[James]

What about it? We have everything we need to be self-sufficient if it comes to it. Luxury items provided by China are not necessary for our survival. If they or anyone else wants to play that game, we can stop letting them come to our universities

[Hartmann]

What about it? We have everything we need to be self-sufficient if it comes to it. Luxury items provided by China are not necessary for our survival. If they or anyone else wants to play that game, we can stop letting them come to our universities

touche... well played

[impala454]

impala, all of your comments are based on the assumption that the U.S. is a de facto power in the world. In truth, the U.S. is slowly moving out of that role, much like Great Britain no longer being the dominating power it was before WWII.

we're moving out of that role?!?!? coulda fooled me. short of a world war, I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess we have more bases in other countries than anyone else by a long shot. hell we're putting anti-nuke missles all over europe! i don't see how we're not the 'de facto' power in the world. especially military wise.

China just sent a "police force" into Sudan and other peacekeeping elements into other parts of Africa. So they can do that and understand it.

i'm not saying they can't do it or don't understand it, they just don't. at least not nearly to the extent that we do. they do seem to be up and coming and kind of stepping it up to help in these areas, which i think is great. that's what the other superpowers should be doing. but them stepping up that kind of aid and policing doesn't knock us down, or mean we're 'turning into great britian'.

International economics yes, so it's quite simple, they want their money just as much as bartender. They are getting paid just enough now to keep them happy, what happens when they aren't happy anymore? We are financing their growth but what happens when they want food? It's a great motivator to takeover land. Just look at history. Why did Japan invade China? Why did Germany go after Russia and the Ukraine (besides genocide)? Why did the Romans invade the surrounding areas (and yet leave the governments in place)?

yeah and what happened to all of those invading countries? do you see japan ruling over china? is germany ruling over russia? are the romans still covering half the eastern map? and in none of those cases were nuclear weapons available, which changes the whole story.

As China and India suck up natural resources and start competing against each other for food sources (since China is expanding into its ag area) they're next step will be to buy food (till they get tired of paying for it), then they are going to forcefully look for land to supply their population.

and where are they going to find said land?

according to wikipedia, we're importing ~200 billion in goods from China per year, but we're also exporting 57 billion in goods to China. we also have more overall exports than China. China's biggest imports come from Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, and us. Their biggest exports go to us, Japan, South Korea, and Germany. Do you think China would go to war and shift their entire economic structure to military spending, so they could break all of these relationships, lose nearly a trillion a year in exports, as well as get their packed in like an anthill asses smartbombed into submission?? There is nothing in it for them, which is why they'll never do it.

I know you guys think I'm some pompous american asshole, but it's not pompous it's the truth. as long as we got our fingers on the triggers there aint a damn thing any other country has on us. our pilots yank & bank better than anyone. our navy outnumbers the next biggest navy by 300%. our bombs are bigger, they can hit a target the size of a shoebox from 80,000 feet. until these kinds of things change, we are the biggest, most significant world superpower.

[James]

Which country shot down their own communications satellite a few weeks ago? China or North Korea? It is kind of related but not really. I can't remember if I read that on here or elsewhere.

EDIT: Looks like China did it back in January. Could've swore this was more recent news though. Looking up DPRK.

EDIT #2: Oh. I see. They blew it up in January and didn't report/confirm the act until June 12. And it was a weather satellite.

[Divergent Realit...]

i think you mean "weather satellite"

[rabble]

you dont just "call in "debt. Case Closed

[Testm0nkey]

and a super power country has never been crumbled and totally demolished before

[impala454]

and a super power country has never been crumbled and totally demolished before

nobody said this would never happen. just not right now or any time soon.

[FORSAKENR320]

nobody said this would never happen. just not right now or any time soon.

heard it in my college history classes.. wish i rememebred who said it. "before any great country can be destroyed by another, it must first destroy it's self from within"

[impala454]

yeah, but the thing is, in history the huge empires that fell went down because they were conquerors and always expanding until their empire was too big to successfully govern itself. while some might argue, we're most definitely not conquerors or expanding our borders.

the other major difference between us and old fallen empires is we only border two countries by land.

[GOB]

you dont just "call in "debt. Case Closed

for the win. their own economy would go down the shitter (along with the rest of the world) if they tried to collect everything.


china: we'll take our money now
us: uh, nope?
china: damn

[rabble]

for the win. their own economy would go down the shitter (along with the rest of the world) if they tried to collect everything.
china: we'll take our money now
us: uh, nope?
china: damn

No, I mean debt has contractual obligations. They won't call it in because they can't without breaking the rules of the contract. What these fearmongering assholes don't tell you is how much debt the US owes to china at any given maturity date (that is when we have to pay them) Let me put it this way, if you have a 30 year mortgage and 10 years into it the company tells you "pay us all of it now," you can tell them to fucking stick it up their ass because you have a signed written agreement for 30 years.

Actually, if we are the ones selling debt to china, then they are giving us money, and as long as we don't waste it then theres nothing wrong with that. If we are buying Chinese debt then I don't really see how their fear mongering works, because we would own a future claim in their country (which is on the up and up, so sounds like a solid investment to me)

[FORSAKENR320]

No, I mean debt has contractual obligations. They won't call it in because they can't without breaking the rules of the contract. What these fearmongering assholes don't tell you is how much debt the US owes to china at any given maturity date (that is when we have to pay them) Let me put it this way, if you have a 30 year mortgage and 10 years into it the company tells you "pay us all of it now," you can tell them to fucking stick it up their ass because you have a signed written agreement for 30 years.

Actually, if we are the ones selling debt to china, then they are giving us money, and as long as we don't waste it then theres nothing wrong with that. If we are buying Chinese debt then I don't really see how their fear mongering works, because we would own a future claim in their country (which is on the up and up, so sounds like a solid investment to me)

your arguement is made much stronger by the picture in your signature... i agree with the jew

[Hartmann]

No, I mean debt has contractual obligations. They won't call it in because they can't without breaking the rules of the contract. What these fearmongering assholes don't tell you is how much debt the US owes to china at any given maturity date (that is when we have to pay them) Let me put it this way, if you have a 30 year mortgage and 10 years into it the company tells you "pay us all of it now," you can tell them to fucking stick it up their ass because you have a signed written agreement for 30 years.

Actually, if we are the ones selling debt to china, then they are giving us money, and as long as we don't waste it then theres nothing wrong with that. If we are buying Chinese debt then I don't really see how their fear mongering works, because we would own a future claim in their country (which is on the up and up, so sounds like a solid investment to me)

Well, thanks for the not-so-nice reply (fearmongering assholes)... My intent in posting this was not to agree or disagree but to start a discussion about China's role and what the role of the U.S. will be. We've also got to keep Russia in the mix as well as their economy rebounds and the emergence of a true middle class is back.

My main question was whether or not the U.S. is slowly becoming Great Britain, a power who was once #1 in the world and is now much lower. Are we going to make the slow drop down the totem pole?

Our debt to China is in the form of cash, they sell us goods, we owe them money. We don't sell debt to China (from what I've found)... I'd like to know where you got your info.

[James]

Jewish Investment Newsletter was the source. Duh!