If you talk the talk, would you walk the walk?, So if we finally decided to end the "middle east conflicts" Options

[Dogmeat]

Ok, I constantly hear the war debated, whatnot, etc ... So here's the million dollar question, especially to men between the ages of 18 and 26.

If you support the war, I am going to make the assumption that you understand the greater ambitions of the fight: Meaning, peace and stability in the middle-east is going to contribute to the free world's way of life. Let's face it folks, when you have fascist islamic dictators controlling %70 of the world's combined oil reserves, this can have a SEVERE impact on your quality of life. With that said, it's also pretty much a given that while far from perfect democracy is far and away the best system of government mankind has invented yet, as far as the general populace is concerned.

So with that assumption, if you support the war, how willing are you to go and fight?

Personally, I've considered joining the military MANY times, before and after college even, but I never did. And I've done some major thinking about this, and what I see happening in the world today, and quite frankly I agree with Gen. Zinni when he says we tried to fight this war "on the cheap", meaning, we needed to go in there even more hardcore with double the amount of troops on the ground as we did, take over the entire fucking country, then let them have it back on OUR terms. ...

But, with that said....I have not voluntarily signed up for the military, but after some serious thought, I think I can honestly say that were a draft ever to become a reality, I would go and fight willingly. I try to be as objective as I can about current events, and while obviously the thought of war is sickening, I really believe that stamping out radical islam and protecting our nations assets (like it or not equates to the oil supply from the middle-east) are worth fighting for. Face it folks, our way of life is dependent on oil, pure and simple. I think our way of life is worth fighting for.

So my question to all the war supporters is, and be PERFECTLY FUCKING HONEST.....How willing would you be to fight for our way of life? I hear and see a lot of people talking the talk, but would you walk the walk?

[impala454]

I would definitely go. Our military is the reason our country exists. I know tons of people in several different branches, and not a single one of them regrets their decision. Even the ones who have had tours in Iraq. Sure they miss their families and their lives here, but they go to defend that way of life. In this day and age you can't pick and choose your fights, you have to fight everyone that threatens your way of life.

[James]

Yeah, I've considered the military several times over the past couple years. It would be a quick way to make these student loans disappear (they're not going anywhere fast on a teacher's salary, which is actually about equal to military salary, even as enlisted) while providing what little service I'm can. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if they upped the maximum age for drafting considering that they just recently upped the max age for voluntary enlistment to 42.

[impala454]

yeah I'm 27... and if I fell out of the age range that'd be sad. I'm definitely out of shape but I know they could whip me into shape pretty quick.

I'll be interested to see how many (if any) choose option #3. That should spur some nice debate.

[FORSAKENR320]

yes. i would go. i don't agree with the way the war is being fought, but i approve of the war. i too have considered joining the military. seriously debated it a year ago, when one of my closest friends asked me to join him (he ships out to irag this friday, the 10th) and it sounds like a cop-out, but the only reasons i didn't was because i was still hoping to get into school, and i would have been forced to leave lauren behind. i don't know if they would have even taken me, i'm in serious bad physical condition.... they don't need guys who can lift a ton, they need guys who can do stamina and cardio, and i can't keep up with that for boot camp.... but if they drafted me, i would go and fight willingly

[jonathan83]

Yeah, I've considered the military several times over the past couple years. It would be a quick way to make these student loans disappear (they're not going anywhere fast on a teacher's salary, which is actually about equal to military salary, even as enlisted) while providing what little service I'm can. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if they upped the maximum age for drafting considering that they just recently upped the max age for voluntary enlistment to 42.

so you would enlist over trying to become an officer? because i'm pretty sure that's the only way you get the loans taken care of.

if there was a draft, i'd just join the service before i got drafted. i've thought about the military before, and its still in my mind sometimes. so yes, i'd fight.

[James]

I'm not too sure about that. I've read stories about how they've been letting people through boot/basic while doing less than 10 push-ups. Maybe they're just stories with no basis, but damn :-\ They've gone really lax lately.

[jonathan83]

I'll be interested to see how many (if any) choose option #3. That should spur some nice debate.

i chose it. here's why. i dont really agree with why we are there, but also i'm not sure that pulling out right now is the best idea. i'm not sure if we should double the troops like bush and mccain are saying, but if the generals and those guys think it could work, then maybe it might. i'm all for fixing and stabilizing the region if it's possible.

[James]

so you would enlist over trying to become an officer? because i'm pretty sure that's the only way you get the loans taken care of.

if there was a draft, i'd just join the service before i got drafted. i've thought about the military before, and its still in my mind sometimes. so yes, i'd fight.

Yes, but you can get the SLRP if you become an Army Officer. They started doing this last October, I think. Other branches are authorized by Congress to provide it to their officer programs, but the Army is the only branch that's suffering from an Officer shortage. Supposedly, there's like a 99% acceptance rate at the moment while other branches have around a 10-20% acceptance rate. The only problem with Army Officer is you don't get to pick where you go and don't find out until you're actually in OCS. I also don't feel I'm worthy of being an officer since I have no experience in the military and almost no experience in a leadership role, so based on that, I'd be willing to enlist as an E-4 and experience something new.

[schwab]

thats what we have mexicans and blacks for



j/k

[impala454]

i chose it. here's why. i dont really agree with why we are there, but also i'm not sure that pulling out right now is the best idea. i'm not sure if we should double the troops like bush and mccain are saying, but if the generals and those guys think it could work, then maybe it might. i'm all for fixing and stabilizing the region if it's possible.

well the reason I figured #3 would be a little controversial, is that I really don't see how one would be willing to go join up and fight for something they don't believe in. given that dogmeat kinda meant fighting as in, toting a rifle and killing people, it would seem difficult to put someone in the crosshairs and pull the trigger if you didn't believe you were just in doing so.

[Hartmann]

I support the war but wouldn't be drafted... I'd make sure as soon as that was announced that I joined up and went to OCS. Much rather be an officer than a grunt.

[jonathan83]

I support the war but wouldn't be drafted... I'd make sure as soon as that was announced that I joined up and went to OCS. Much rather be an officer than a grunt.

yeah same

[FORSAKENR320]

well the reason I figured #3 would be a little controversial, is that I really don't see how one would be willing to go join up and fight for something they don't believe in. given that dogmeat kinda meant fighting as in, toting a rifle and killing people, it would seem difficult to put someone in the crosshairs and pull the trigger if you didn't believe you were just in doing so.

i never, ever want to kill someone... i've always feared having to pull my gun on someone, and i've only had to do it once so far. but if i had to kill someone, i would. if someone forced me to shoot them, i'm going to make sure they aren't walking away from it. mostly because that person FORCED me to do it, and i'd be acting out of anger. not wanting to, and not capable of, are 2 things.


but in this situation, i'd prolly just rely on my racial slurs and state-fed bigotry to come through in that situation... heh

[cupcake]

just touching on a couple points for clarification...

I agree with Gen. Zinni when he says we tried to fight this war "on the cheap", meaning, we needed to go in there even more hardcore with double the amount of troops on the ground as we did, take over the entire fucking country, then let them have it back on OUR terms. ...

Gen Zinni was my commander in somalia and he does not fuck around. this is post-TFR (blackhawk down incident), and it's a pretty untold story. the guy is a modern-day warrior king. listen to his words with attentive ears.

i don't know if they would have even taken me, i'm in serious bad physical condition.... they don't need guys who can lift a ton, they need guys who can do stamina and cardio, and i can't keep up with that for boot camp....

in Boot, if you cannot pass the initial "inventory" PFT, you are cycled through to PCP (physical conditioning platoon), and there you basically eat healthy and workout/run all the time until you can pass the inventory PFT, at which point you get cycled back into a training platoon. no one needs to be bruce jenner before they get to Boot.

so you would enlist over trying to become an officer? because i'm pretty sure that's the only way you get the loans taken care of.

true, there are programs for officers that pay off your stuloans. there are also signing bonuses for enlisted that are a big chuck up front (like 20g's).

I've read stories about how they've been letting people through boot/basic while doing less than 10 push-ups. Maybe they're just stories with no basis, but damn :-\ They've gone really lax lately.

I've never heard that, but I can't speak for all services. a lot of this depends on what branch, and in the army's case, what branch of the army (combat arms Basic Training pipeline is much different than big army).

I also don't feel I'm worthy of being an officer since I have no experience in the military and almost no experience in a leadership role, so based on that, I'd be willing to enlist as an E-4 and experience something new.

hold on now! LOL

few...if any 22yr old boot Lt.s have quality leadership experience. That's what OCS, TBS, and then your NCO's are for. In combat arms, E-4's (Corporals) require much more real-world experience than a boot Lt. "the strategic corporal" (google it) is who runs the modern ground war.

Much rather be an officer than a grunt.

ouch. not ouch as in enlisted...but ouch as in "grunts" as enlisted.

"grunts" means infantry...officers can be grunts (my dad was a grunt officer). the term is a badge of misery and honor we hold dear. recall the movie 'aliens', where that guy says "corporal hicks is just a grunt...no offense"..."none taken". it's like that yo...