another low down stunt, from our favorite president Options

[Jim]

save your book report for someone else, professor peabody.

I know firsthand a little wall-to-wall counseling renders effective results.

If I have vital information and someone starts torturing me, I'll probably give them false information out of spite.

[pebkac]

save your book report for someone else, professor peabody.

I know firsthand a little wall-to-wall counseling renders effective results.

Yes. If you torture somebody, I can guarantee you with 100% certainty that they'll tell you something. Anything. Whatever it takes to get out of that situation. Even if they don't know anything at all.

[Mommy]

So you're saying legal aliens should have no rights?

i didnt say that. but when its a matter of national security...yes. I dont feel like explaining my whole point but in essence, they chose to come over here and not take the proper steps in becoming a citizen. If they are suspect of something, I dont care if more steps are taken to find out information... wiretappings, unwarranted searches, and yes a minimal amount of fear. remember.... NATIONAL SECURITY...in other words our citizens lives are at stake.

[Jim]

i didnt say that. but when its a matter of national security...yes. I dont feel like explaining my whole point but in essence, they chose to come over here and not take the proper steps in becoming a citizen. If they are suspect of something, I dont care if more steps are taken to find out information... wiretappings, unwarranted searches, and yes a minimal amount of fear. remember.... NATIONAL SECURITY...in other words our citizens lives are at stake.

Am I less equal?

[pebkac]

i didnt say that. but when its a matter of national security...yes. I dont feel like explaining my whole point but in essence, they chose to come over here and not take the proper steps in becoming a citizen. If they are suspect of something, I dont care if more steps are taken to find out information... wiretappings, unwarranted searches, and yes a minimal amount of fear. remember.... NATIONAL SECURITY...in other words our citizens lives are at stake.

So what you're saying is that you believe it's just for someone to be held against their will when they don't have any ties to any terrorist organizations?

[Mommy]

Am I less equal?

are you canadian?

if so, yes

[cupcake]

If I have vital information and someone starts torturing me, I'll probably give them false information out of spite.

no you won't.

everyone breaks. sure there are anomalies that won't break, or can deceive, but they are very low percentage. even those going in with good training under their belts fail.

the average person off the street will fail miserably.

those who want your intel are well-versed enough in the gig to distinguish lies from the truth.

do a little of your beloved web-research and find the various methods/symptoms of lie detecting.

you'll just get worse treatment for lying.

[cupcake]

Yes.  If you torture somebody, I can guarantee you with 100% certainty that they'll tell you something.  Anything.  Whatever it takes to get out of that situation.  Even if they don't know anything at all.

keyword in my post was "effective".

no, you can usually tell within a few minutes who's bs'ing just to get out of a beating and who is actually hiding something.

[Jim]

no you won't.

everyone breaks. sure there are anomalies that won't break, or can deceive, but they are very low percentage. even those going in with good training under their belts fail.

the average person off the street will fail miserably.

those who want your intel are well-versed enough in the gig to distinguish lies from the truth.

do a little of your beloved web-research and find the various methods/symptoms of lie detecting.

you'll just get worse treatment for lying.

And you speak from personal experience or are you just infallible?

[cupcake]

So what you're saying is that you believe it's just for someone to be held against their will when they don't have any ties to any terrorist organizations?

where in her post did she say that?

I didn't read it that way.

[The Fanatic]

if this is in any way a reference to 1984, I will hereby stop reading your opinoin alltogether. Great book, but people compare it to everything and its a FICTIONAL book. Yes, be critical of the government...WITH THINGS THAT MATTER. this doesnt matter right now because we dont know the full scope of the law. Find out what the law says from something other than a news commentary show. I can guarantee he is blowing it way out of proportion.

and just for the record, I dont like bush so im not sucking his dick. I just think that its retarded to start 4 billion threads all about the same damn thing.

It was not a reference to 1984, there are plenty of place and times when such things were practiced on a daily basis

[The Fanatic]

your analogy has zero fruit.

you robbing a store is not going to possibly save lives or strike a blow against the enemy of the america.

Analogy is not meant to be perfect... it is meant to proove a point, that no one should be above the law.

[Mommy]

So what you're saying is that you believe it's just for someone to be held against their will when they don't have any ties to any terrorist organizations?

I said if they are a suspect. Im sorry, but I was born here. I am a citizen. I get more rights then aliens because thats how our government works. Aliens cant vote either. Why arent you bitching about that? There shouldn't have to be some strong evidence but not like this:

Okay, I'd have to see a video of him singing "Pee On You," two forms of government ID, a police officer there to verify the whole thing, four or five of my buddies and Neal taking notes, and R. Kelly's grandma to confirm his identity.

This post has been edited by Jessica: Oct 4 2006, 02:43 PM

[cupcake]

And you speak from personal experience or are you just infallible?

certainly not infallible. just experienced it on both sides. but I am no expert in it by any means.

[pebkac]

keyword in my post was "effective".

no, you can usually tell within a few minutes who's bs'ing just to get out of a beating and who is actually hiding something.

I refer you back to my source:

Or listen to Army Col. Stuart Herrington, a military intelligence specialist who conducted interrogations in Vietnam, Panama and Iraq during Desert Storm, and who was sent by the Pentagon in 2003 -- long before Abu Ghraib -- to assess interrogations in Iraq. Aside from its immorality and its illegality, says Herrington, torture is simply "not a good way to get information." In his experience, nine out of 10 people can be persuaded to talk with no "stress methods" at all, let alone cruel and unusual ones. Asked whether that would be true of religiously motivated fanatics, he says that the "batting average" might be lower: "perhaps six out of ten." And if you beat up the remaining four? "They'll just tell you anything to get you to stop."

You have at best an ineffective way of getting information and at worst a dangerous source of misinformation. Take your pick.