How was your voting experience?, Mine was a joke; Other things noted. Options

[impala454]

wait impala, you dont think people have to either be CEO's or have a bunch of corporation backing to make it into politics?

No I don't think people have to be CEOs. That notion is just dumb... I don't think I can even think of any politicians who are/were CEOs.

And I dunno where you or fanatic get the idea that corporations are the ones providing all this money. That would be highly illegal if it were true.

[Melanie]

Hillary may have won Texas, but she did not win the delegate count. So that made me happy.

I had a pretty good experience. I voted the first day early voting polls were open. Now I had issues at caucusing. I am the only Precinct Chair in my area and I had some older people look at me like I was crazy because I had the packet. We had some extremely overzealous supporters and then we had some people that just wanted to get out. Everyone pretty much left after they signed in and didn't stay for the referendums. But in all, the delegates were split 6-6. Nothing too crazy. Just some angry people. One very angry gay older gentleman was yelling at me and then he screwed up his own precinct convention.

[theIncredibleEdi...]

Hillary may have won Texas, but she did not win the delegate count. So that made me happy.

I had a pretty good experience. I voted the first day early voting polls were open. Now I had issues at caucusing. I am the only Precinct Chair in my area and I had some older people look at me like I was crazy because I had the packet. We had some extremely overzealous supporters and then we had some people that just wanted to get out. Everyone pretty much left after they signed in and didn't stay for the referendums. But in all, the delegates were split 6-6. Nothing too crazy. Just some angry people. One very angry gay older gentleman was yelling at me and then he screwed up his own precinct convention.

Don't mess with them political queens...they will fucccckkkkk yoooouuuuu upppppp!!!

[Testm0nkey]

No I don't think people have to be CEOs. That notion is just dumb... I don't think I can even think of any politicians who are/were CEOs.

lots of politicians were former business CEO's. if you werent aware of that... well than i dunno. mitt romney for example, cheney for example, bush for example and that was just off the top of my head

if its not lobbyists that are backings for corporations or businesses themselves how do you think these people each made millions and millions of dollars?

so let me get this straight. you dont trust the average american to not be a terrorist but you believe any dude off the street with a passion could be president? your mix of ideologies are blowing me away

[impala454]

lots of politicians were former business CEO's. if you werent aware of that... well than i dunno. mitt romney for example, cheney for example, bush for example and that was just off the top of my head

what company was Bush the CEO for? And I didn't say there were none, I just said couldn't think of any. Which isn't too surprising considering I don't study bios of politicians all day. Your statement was: "you dont think people have to either be CEO's or have a bunch of corporation backing to make it into politics?" No, people don't have to be CEOs or have a bunch of corporation backing. The three top candidates for president right now were no where near the top of any company. And like I said, it is illegal for corporations to donate money to a political campaign.

if its not lobbyists that are backings for corporations or businesses themselves how do you think these people each made millions and millions of dollars?

Individual contributions.

so let me get this straight. you dont trust the average american to not be a terrorist but you believe any dude off the street with a passion could be president? your mix of ideologies are blowing me away

I definitely trust the average American to not be a terrorist... not sure where you got that idea from. And yes any dude off the street with a passion could be president. It's simply a matter of votes.

[The Fanatic]

what company was Bush the CEO for? And I didn't say there were none, I just said couldn't think of any. Which isn't too surprising considering I don't study bios of politicians all day. Your statement was: "you dont think people have to either be CEO's or have a bunch of corporation backing to make it into politics?" No, people don't have to be CEOs or have a bunch of corporation backing. The three top candidates for president right now were no where near the top of any company. And like I said, it is illegal for corporations to donate money to a political campaign.
Individual contributions.
I definitely trust the average American to not be a terrorist... not sure where you got that idea from. And yes any dude off the street with a passion could be president. It's simply a matter of votes.

It is illegal for corporations to donate money to a political campaigns but like I said in my earlier post there are loopholes known as Political Action Committees or PACs.

corporations may establish "separate segregated funds," commonly known as political action committees, or PACs. A corporation may solicit its restricted class to contribute up to $5,000 per person per year to its PAC; payroll "check-off" plans for these contributions are widely used. The PAC in turn can contribute up to $5,000 per election (the primary and general elections each count as one election) to a favored candidate. The corporation may solicit each member of its restricted class as often as it likes, and may even (subject to some important restrictions) solicit all its employees twice a year. The corporation may pay the PAC's administrative costs, including legal, accounting, and fund-raising solicitation costs, out of its treasury funds.

source: http://library.findlaw.com/2002/Aug/14/131015.html

Bush was the CEO of spectrum 7 and was on the board of Harken Energy

In 1986 Arbusto Energy was bought by Harken for $2.2 million. As part of the deal George W. Bush served on Harken's board of directors through to 1993. He was also paid fees as a consultant for the company.

source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harken_Energy
source http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectrum_7

This post has been edited by The Fanatic: Mar 7 2008, 03:51 PM

[impala454]

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/index.asp

Barack Obama
Total Funds Raised: $138,231,595
Total PAC contributions: $25 (yes, twenty-five dollars)

Hillary Clinton
Total Funds Raised: $134,536,488
Total PAC contributions: $1,045,419

John McCain
Total Funds Raised: $53,717,085
Total PAC contributions: $579,424

Yeah, so we can really see where all those loopholes are letting large corporations "buy" a candidate's support.


And I failed to see where Bush was a CEO or where that company financed his campaigns.

[Testm0nkey]

george had an oil company out in midland that he was the CEO of.

my dad is a pretty die hard 'merican and even he knows that 134,535,488 or any of those dollar amounts werent pure american citizen contributions. $326,485,168????? come on now. when you take into consideration the average amercian earns 20k or so less than you probably earn in a year and DOESNT vote or pay attention to politics.... whos giving that money?! theres also the loophole of "private citizens" who just happen to be billionaires donating money that may or may not be private funds and business funds under the table. just about every politician in the world has gotten in trouble for taking that kind of dough. including several of the political campaigners this year

[impala454]

Well, when you hold 1000 seat formal dinners at $10,000/plate, it adds up pretty quick.

[Testm0nkey]

and do you think the average american attends those? and typically they arent 10k / plate unless you are sitting at a really nice table. its just another way to get under the table funnnnnnds

[The Fanatic]

Impala, you are aware that those are the amounts of money that they disclosed. Some politians have been known to lie in the past. But ok ok, let's assume that these numbers are totally correct. If I am a PAC and I donate 5,000 dollars to your campaign and let's say individuals donated 20 dollars a piece to my campaign... where is my loyalty going to lie? More of my vestted loyaltly lies with the PAC because it donated a larger piece. Individuals have varying demands and ideas when it comes to policy while PACs are advocating a specfic policy goal. Keep in mind that individuals are limited to 2,300 dollars contributions while PACs can donate up to 5,000.


From your source:

Hillary Clinton


No Disclosure
$9,228,743
(10.0%)

Barack Obama

No Disclosure
$6,440,636
(8.2%)

John McCain
No Disclosure
$1,978,798
(6.3%)

And thank you for pointing out that Barack Obama has received virtually NO MONEY from corporations. One of the many reasons that I support him.

Analyzing campaign finance records, the non-partisan Center for Responsive Politics found that iGate, Inc. CEO Vernon L. Jackson and his wife, Sandra, contributed $26,000 to the three Democrats in 2001 and 2003.

Source: http://capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=216

More than 300 members of the 109th Congress received campaign contributions from a client of Jack Abramoff while he was their lobbyist—81 Senators and 227 members of the House of Representatives, the Center found. On average, each recipient got about $16,000.

President Bush received nearly $50,000 from Abramoff’s clients. Top congressional recipients included a who’s who of the Republican leadership in Congress. Prominent names include House Speaker Dennis Hastert of Illinois ($68,300 in contributions), House Republican Conference Secretary John Doolittle of California ($56,250) and Montana Sen. Conrad Burns ($52,340). Also on the list is former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay of Texas ($44,000), who once employed convicted Abramoff associates Tony Rudy and Michael Scanlon on Capitol Hill. DeLay’s successor, Rep. John Boehner of Ohio, received $30,500.

Source: http://capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=210


Scratch my back and i'll scratch yours:

Of the $2.3 billion in contracts awarded by the federal government in the weeks since Katrina ravaged the Gulf Coast, at least 15 exceed $100 million; including five that are valued at $500 million or more, according to a New York Times analysis. More than 80 percent of those contracts were awarded with little or no competition.

On October 6, newly installed Federal Emergency Management Agency chief R. David Paulison told a Senate panel that the agency plans to open up several contracts that were previously awarded without competition to competitive bidding, including four contracts worth $100 million each.

Several of the companies that won huge contracts have close ties to Washington lobbyists, as well as lawmakers. They include AshBritt Environmental, based in Pompano Beach, Fla., and Halliburton subsidiary Kellogg, Brown & Root. Baton Rouge, La.-based Shaw Environmental, a subsidiary of the Shaw Group, is the largest local company, with 18,000 employees, to receive Katrina contracts, according to government records

Source: http://www.capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=188

July 01, 2005 | Campaign contributions from the sugar industry were a solid predictor of how senators voted late Thursday on the Central American Free Trade Agreement, which would remove trade barriers in place between the United States and Costa Rica, the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras and Nicaragua.

The Senate passed the bill, 54-45, despite concerns from sugar farmers, textile makers and labor unions that the agreement would subject them to competition from lower priced Central American imports and eliminate U.S. jobs

he Republicans who voted in favor of CAFTA have received an average of $8,176 from sugar interests, substantially less than the $13,605, on average, collected by the agreement’s Democratic supporters. Jeffords has raised $11,750 from the sugar industry since 1999.

The Democrats who voted against the measure have received an average of $18,531 from the sugar industry, while the dozen GOP lawmakers who opposed it have received an average of $12,135.

source:

http://www.capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=174

In 1984, Spectrum 7 merged with George W. Bush's Arbusto Energy. After the merger, Bush became the Chairman and CEO of Spectrum 7.

Source: the wikipedia one from earlier

[impala454]

and do you think the average american attends those?

wtf do you want? do you want the $100,000,000 they raise to be shown to be all from 5 year olds dropping pennies into their buckets as they walk by?? sheesh.

and typically they arent 10k / plate unless you are sitting at a really nice table.

Hi miss I-pull-BS-outta-my-ass, welcome back. Where do you get off saying this? I saw multiple times on TV, shows describing how these candidates make money. It showed a formal dinner that Hillary Clinton was holding, with 1,000 seats, and each seat cost $10,000.

its just another way to get under the table funnnnnnds

How the hell is that under the table? It's people who want to donate to the campaign.

[impala454]

Impala, you are aware that those are the amounts of money that they disclosed. Some politians have been known to lie in the past. But ok ok, let's assume that these numbers are totally correct. If I am a PAC and I donate 5,000 dollars to your campaign and let's say individuals donated 20 dollars a piece to my campaign... where is my loyalty going to lie? More of my vestted loyaltly lies with the PAC because it donated a larger piece. Individuals have varying demands and ideas when it comes to policy while PACs are advocating a specfic policy goal. Keep in mind that individuals are limited to 2,300 dollars contributions while PACs can donate up to 5,000.
From your source:

Hillary Clinton
No Disclosure
$9,228,743
(10.0%)

Barack Obama

No Disclosure
$6,440,636
(8.2%)

John McCain
No Disclosure
$1,978,798
(6.3%)

And thank you for pointing out that Barack Obama has received virtually NO MONEY from corporations. One of the many reasons that I support him.


Source: http://capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=216


Source: http://capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=210
Scratch my back and i'll scratch yours:
Source: http://www.capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=188
source:

http://www.capitaleye.org/inside.asp?ID=174
Source: the wikipedia one from earlier

Your original statement was that these corporations are basically "buying" candidates. From your own numbers you just posted, not a single candidate has more than 10% of their campaign funds coming from "loopholed corporate donations." How about the other 90%? Not to mention that little old thing they have to do after they've spent all that campaign money... oh yeah... win the election.

[Testm0nkey]

am i the only one that has looked into going to a pay-for-your-plate campaign dinner? the fee for me would have been $500. other times ive looked into it they were invite or $1k. i am sure they have dinners that are 10k but from what i have experienced they dont seem to ALL be that high

[Dogmeat]

I am going to pee on all of those $10,000 plates.