Impala/Oasis BitchFest 2009, Someone call the waahbulance! Options

[Dogmeat]

You wanna know why you never get laid? You're a whiny bitch. Seriously. We get you don't like the fucking game. Give it a rest already, nancy boy

I'm going to drive to texas and kill you.

[Oasis]

I'm going to drive to texas and kill you.

You drive a Chevy. You'd break down before you ever made it to Austin

[Mommy]

He doesn't drive a Chevy. He used to own a GM (yeah, same company), but he bought something else less than a year ago. You're the one that had a Chevy.

[Oasis]

He doesn't drive a Chevy. He used to own a GM (yeah, same company), but he bought something else less than a year ago. You're the one that had a Chevy.

I don't anymore.

[Mommy]

I don't anymore.

Hence I said HAD... And he doesn't own a GM truck anymore... So he HAD one too. Guess you both were driving around klankers.

[Oasis]

Hence I said HAD... And he doesn't own a GM truck anymore... So he HAD one too. Guess you both were driving around klankers.

Yeah I learned my lesson. Fuck GM, no wonder they're failing

[impala454]

They're failing because they have absurd UAW contracts, not because of vehicle quality.

[chook]

They Envoy I'm renting is pretty nice.

[Oasis]

They're failing because they have absurd UAW contracts, not because of vehicle quality.

I know. But speaking for myself and most people I know who've owned GM, all of us switched to European/Jap and for good reason. Better gas mileage, better build quality, and last 1.5x as long as American garbage

[impala454]

Ok Cathryn

[Oasis]

Ok Cathryn

What in the hell is that supposed to mean?

[impala454]

nevermind Will it's not even worth it.

[Mommy]

What in the hell is that supposed to mean?

Well, you act like a hippy fag now.

Sorry, someone had to say it.

[Oasis]

Well, you act like a hippy fag now.

Sorry, someone had to say it.

I know exactly what the ignorant dipshit meant.

Charles, are you really this dumb or is it an act? You're insinuating that I'm a hippie because I want the best car for my money? Sorry, GM products suck. They last about 75k miles before falling apart and becoming completely cost inefficient to own. It doesn't make me a hippie or a socialist or a terrorist to say that SOMETIMES, AMERICAN MADE PRODUCTS ARE INFERIOR TO FOREIGN PRODUCTS. Sorry if reading the capitalized part gives your disgustingly fat and lazy American ass a panic attack, since we all know how blindly and ignorantly you'll defend this country whether it's going to shit or not. Keep driving your gas guzzling truck and being an utterly clueless. By the time your three year, 36k mile warranty expires and your truck starts falling apart, it won't really matter if you have to pay for everything yourself, since GM will have hopefully gone under due to running their business like idiots and making garbage products

Seriously, why did you come back here? You were an ignorant moron last time and no one liked you, you're still an ignorant moron and no one likes you. Take a hint man

[Mommy]

Lance, can you please change Will's screen name to Testmonkey. It would make things a lot less confusing.

[Oasis]

Lance, can you please change Will's screen name to Testmonkey. It would make things a lot less confusing.

OK. But change impala's to dumbfuck, so I never again confuse him for an intelligent human being

On a serious note, I don't recall Cathryn ever liking foreign cars. She just liked hybrids that would save her money on gas that she can put toward other things that aren't called hygiene products.

[impala454]

I know exactly what the ignorant dipshit meant.

Apparently not. I think you read a little too far into it bud. So your rant and subsequent insults were a little unfounded really.

[Mommy]

Apparently not. I think you read a little too far into it bud. So your rant and subsequent insults were a little unfounded really.

Will likes to type. Don't take it personal. It's like those people that like the sound of their own voice, except this is with typing on the internet.

[Oasis]

Apparently not. I think you read a little too far into it bud. So your rant and subsequent insults were a little unfounded really.

I asked for an explanation, you didn't give one. Next time try giving an explanation when asked

[Mommy]

Because, you know, him giving an explanation is going to change everything. Besides, you said "I know exactly what the ignorant dipshit meant." I guess he didn't really need to give an explanation then, did he? Seems to me that you were/are just trying to entice an argument.

[Oasis]

Because, you know, him giving an explanation is going to change everything. Besides, you said "I know exactly what the ignorant dipshit meant." I guess he didn't really need to give an explanation then, did he? Seems to me that you were/are just trying to entice an argument.

My assumption was based on the fact that every single time someone insults America, and American company, or something negative involving politics he gets his panties in a bunch and starts whining like a retarded schoolgirl

[Spectatrix]

I agree with Will (yes, I said it). He may be a dumbfuck about a lot of things, but he's right that foreign cars are largely superior to American ones. Ford is decent, but GM and Chrysler suck. Yes, part of their failure is due to the UAW, but their vehicle quality also leaves a lot to be desired.

[impala454]

I asked for an explanation, you didn't give one. Next time try giving an explanation when asked

I said it wasn't worth explaining, because it wasn't.

[impala454]

their vehicle quality also leaves a lot to be desired.

How do you arrive at this conclusion?

And no the UAW is not just a "part" of the failure, it's the entire failure. If you look at the companies side by side, it's the only difference. Sales, marketing, product development, every other part of the companies is identical except for the UAW bullshit.

So IMHO you all need to dispense w/the Cathrynisms. (i.e. just for Will, the "most scientist say that _____________" bullshit)

[Spectatrix]

How do you arrive at this conclusion?

How about this, for starters: JD Power & Associates 2008 Initial Quality Study

Let's look at the cars.



Porsche - German
Infiniti - Japanese
Lexus - Japanese
Mercedes-Benz - German
Toyota -Japanese
Mercury - US (Ford)
Honda - Japanese
Ford - US
Jaguar - British
Audi - German
Cadillac - US (GM)
Chevrolet - US (GM)
Hyundai - Korean
Pontiac - US (GM)
Lincoln - US (Ford)
Buick - US (GM)

Nah, it's not a comprehensive assessment of quality, but the top 10 is dominated by Japanese and German automakers, with a couple of appearances by Ford. It's not until #11 that you get to GM.

[THECHICKEN]

lol @ people arguing american being as good as foreign quality

[impala454]

Are you friggin kidding me Christine? Come on you're an engineer, why don't you quantify the data you posted and think about it. That number given is problems per 100 vehicles in the first 90 days. So Jaguar scored a 1.12 problems per vehicle, whereas Honda scored a 1.10. Gimme a break. Does this mean you're going to have 0.02 more problems with a Jag on average, so you should buy a Honda instead?

It certainly doesn't help qualify the unfounded, generalized Cathryn-like (see I explained it again Will) statements Will was making like "Better gas mileage, better build quality, and last 1.5x as long as American garbage", or your comment that "Ford is decent, but GM and Chrysler suck". When you say that it's your view of the company & the bailouts clouding your judgement. It has nothing to do with vehicle quality. Hell, look at the other findings in that report, the domestic trucks swept their categories altogether. And the absolute maximum difference between first and last is 0.8. Not even a whole number. So if you buy a Jeep instead of a Porcshe, there's a good chance there might be two problems instead of one...

These statements remind me of a buddy of mine in college who was a huge Metallica fan. He loved every single song, had every CD, had autographs, posters, etc. Then when the napster debacle happened, he decided he hated them. he started talking about how bad their music sucked. The exact same songs. Fade to Black didn't suddenly change. Yeah ok he doesn't like the band anymore, that's fine. But the CD sitting on his shelf didn't change. Just like nothing has changed on the assembly line with any of these companies. It's the business end (pun intended) that's having issues. And if you sit back and take notice, the business end of pretty much every automaker is having major problems right now. It's simply a problem amplified in GM & Chrysler due to their out of control operating costs due to the UAW. If Obama really wanted to bail them out he'd give them a way to get rid of that shit. But since he's a socialist prick, labor unions are right up his alley.

[Oasis]

Yet again, Charles will just believe whatever the hell he wants because he's an idiot. Nevermind what scientists, researchers, or anyone says, he just writes and argues for whatever his pea brain tells him to

[Oasis]

It certainly doesn't help qualify the unfounded, generalized Cathryn-like (see I explained it again Will) statements Will was making like "Better gas mileage, better build quality, and last 1.5x as long as American garbage", or your comment that "Ford is decent, but GM and Chrysler suck". When you say that it's your view of the company & the bailouts clouding your judgement. It has nothing to do with vehicle quality. Hell, look at the other findings in that report, the domestic trucks swept their categories altogether. And the absolute maximum difference between first and last is 0.8. Not even a whole number. So if you buy a Jeep instead of a Porcshe, there's a good chance there might be two problems instead of one...

Jesus Christ Charles, do you even read what people write? I don't dislike GM because of the bailout issue, I dislike them because every single Chevrolet I've owned was a piece of shit. Most of my friends who drive GM products (cars and trucks) say this one will be their last as well. And it has EVERYTHING to do with vehicle quality, or more specifically lack thereof.

I know you drive a GMC truck, and due to your inability to ever change your opinion about anything ever because you're a closed minded dimwit, you'll probably run this argument in to the ground. If you want to continue to drive inferior automobiles, that's your problem, not mine.

[THECHICKEN]

The only thing that comes from chevy i like is the vette...

rest is crap

[impala454]

Jesus Christ Charles, do you even read what people write?

Do you? You might want to go back and read that my response was to Christine, not you. (btw, It's just Charles, I don't usually carry the Jesus Christ title)

I know you drive a GMC truck,

No I don't.

[impala454]

Nevermind what scientists, researchers, or anyone says

Seriously, tell Cat to get off your computer...

[Mommy]

I never said I agreed with Charles. I just think Will is a dumb ass.

Might I say though that Chrysler Dodge's new Challenger is the sex. Too bad they aren't offering huge discounts on that vehicle. They have excluded it from all their mass discounts.

[Oasis]

I never said I agreed with Charles. I just think Will is a dumb ass.

Might I say though that Chrysler Dodge's new Challenger is the sex. Too bad they aren't offering huge discounts on that vehicle. They have excluded it from all their mass discounts.

Don't worry, I think the same of you.

And I'm going to buy a Challenger (not the SRT8, don't have $50k laying around) when the Camaro gets released. The release of the Camaro should take interest away from the Challenger to the point where dealers aren't marking them up over MSRP

[Mommy]

Don't worry, I think the same of you.

And I'm going to buy a Challenger (not the SRT8, don't have $50k laying around) when the Camaro gets released. The release of the Camaro should take interest away from the Challenger to the point where dealers aren't marking them up over MSRP

Yeah right... I seriously doubt you will buy that car. You always say you are going to buy a car, but you never do.

[Oasis]

Yeah right... I seriously doubt you will buy that car. You always say you are going to buy a car, but you never do.

I won't be buying one till next year at the earliest. Until the 2011 models come out they'll be way too expensive because demand will far outweigh supply. Hoping the Camaro will offer some competition and disperse consumer dollars away from the Challenger. Plus I just bought a car so I don't wanna buy another one too soon

[woody]

I won't be buying one till next year at the earliest. Until the 2011 models come out they'll be way too expensive because demand will far outweigh supply. Hoping the Camaro will offer some competition and disperse consumer dollars away from the Challenger. Plus I just bought a car so I don't wanna buy another one too soon

So you complain about American cars...

then say you're going to buy one...

[Mommy]

lol, I know right.... and a Dodge at that.

[Oasis]

So you complain about American cars...

then say you're going to buy one...

And I never specifically said buy foreign. How about buy the best product on the market, regardless of where it's made? I really do hope American car companies would start building better quality cars. Unfortunately, right now they're lagging behind foreign manufacturers

As for the Challenger, I'm sure it'll crap out after 80k miles...but sweet Jesus, think about all the teenage ass I'll get from miles 1-79999!

[Mommy]

Heaven forbid you date someone over 20. It seems you thrive off of drama, though, and those youngins sure do bring the drama.

[Oasis]

Heaven forbid you date someone over 20. It seems you thrive off of drama, though, and those youngins sure do bring the drama.

Haha I was joking. I dated a few 19 year olds. NEVER AGAIN! My girlfriend is 26

[impala454]

All this hate over certain car brands... they're all fine. If you buy one new and take care of it, any vehicle should be fine. If you buy used you really take the risk of getting a vehicle that was abused.

[jonathan83]

All this hate over certain car brands... they're all fine. If you buy one new and take care of it, any vehicle should be fine. If you buy used you really take the risk of getting a vehicle that was abused molested.

fify

[Spectatrix]

Are you friggin kidding me Christine? Come on you're an engineer, why don't you quantify the data you posted and think about it. That number given is problems per 100 vehicles in the first 90 days. So Jaguar scored a 1.12 problems per vehicle, whereas Honda scored a 1.10. Gimme a break. Does this mean you're going to have 0.02 more problems with a Jag on average, so you should buy a Honda instead?

Oh, you're not going to rail about what a bunch of BS statistical analysis is? Color me surprised.

I could also go and look up the Consumer Reports data that supports the assertion that foreign cars are better than domestic, but I went with the first thing I found. Gimme a break, I WAS IN THE FREAKIN' HOSPITAL.

No, not all GMs suck. No, not all Chryslers suck. Yes, Toyota and Honda have some bad models and will have lemons, just like any other company. But overall, quality assessments favor foreign vehicles over domestic ones. From the Consumer Reports stuff I've read in the past, plus anecdotal evidence from friends & family, I trust Toyota and Honda over domestic vehicles. That's not a stupid or hippy-ish assessment. Vehicle quality is a large part of the reason why Ford is weathering the economic problems rather well, while the other two are on the verge of bankruptcy. The UAW sucks donkey dick, but they are not the *only* reason those two car companies are suffering.

[impala454]

I could also go and look up the Consumer Reports data that supports the assertion that foreign cars are better than domestic, but I went with the first thing I found. Gimme a break, I WAS IN THE FREAKIN' HOSPITAL.

Hospital... that's no excuse!

No, not all GMs suck. No, not all Chryslers suck. Yes, Toyota and Honda have some bad models and will have lemons, just like any other company. But overall, quality assessments favor foreign vehicles over domestic ones. From the Consumer Reports stuff I've read in the past, plus anecdotal evidence from friends & family, I trust Toyota and Honda over domestic vehicles.

That's perfectly fine for you to use your own anecdotal evidence and what you read to choose a vehicle or a brand you prefer. I do the same thing. But it's not some overwhelming evidence of fundamental "build quality" differences between various companies.

That's not a stupid or hippy-ish assessment.

For the record (since apparently my references to Cathryn were more subtle than I anticipated), I was referring to her constant generalizing of everything. I.e. "most scientists believe blah". That's very simlilar to the statements being made in this thread.

Vehicle quality is a large part of the reason why Ford is weathering the economic problems rather well, while the other two are on the verge of bankruptcy. The UAW sucks donkey dick, but they are not the *only* reason those two car companies are suffering.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. All you have to do is take a few minutes to look at the companies' financials. It's definitely not for a lack of revenue (vehicle sales). If vehicle quality was any part of the reason for the domestic's financial troubles, then how is it they're still selling so many vehicles?

http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_3022-autosales.html
Top 20 vehicle sales for March 2009 (in order):

Ford PU
Toyota Camry
Chevy Silverado
Honda Accord
Toyota Corolla
Honda Civic
Nissan Altima
Dodge Ram
Chevy Malibu
Honda CRV
Ford Fusion
Chevy Impala
Ford Escape
Hyundai Sonata
Ford Focus
Toyota RAV4
Dodge Caravan
Jeep Wrangler
Pontiac G6
Mazda 3

12 of the top 20 are domestic vehicles. 4 of the top 10 are domestics. Not a single foreign pickup even made the list. So these generalized ideas that "build quality" suffers are a little unfounded in my opinion. Deciding which vehicle/brand you like, of course is no big deal. But choosing what you like and then deciding the others are crap, dumb IMHO. I had a run of bad luck at one of the local fancy steakhouses around here. It doesn't mean it's not a great place, but I am a little turned off to go there now. Make sense?

[Spectatrix]

Nice rebuttal with the sales numbers.

Weird side note... I'm sure you heard some months ago that GM is dropping a bunch of brands in order to cut costs and focus on core business. One of those lines is Saturn, which I'd always understood to be wildly popular/successful. Read somewhere that they hadn't made money on the brand in like 10 years. Why in god's name would they take a loss on a brand line for over a DECADE?!? I'm a little too rational to want to warp my brain looking at their financials, but even the little bit I hear about blows my fucking mind.

[Spectatrix]

Oh, here's a Consumer Reports thing I found real quick: http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/ne...nd-worst-ov.htm

On the overall best/worst, only one domestic in top cars (Corvette Z06), two foreign in worst (Smart ForTwo -- does this even count as a vehicle really, lol? and Toyota FJ Cruiser).

Will you concede that currently, foreign quality is generally (but not always) better? That doesn't mean domestic totally sucks (I was using hyperbole earlier), but that foreign usually edges domestic out. I am certainly willing to concede that quality impacts sales less than I thought, based on the numbers you provided in your last post.

This post has been edited by Spectatrix: Apr 2 2009, 02:49 PM

[impala454]

I appreciate how compromising you're being but I can't concede that generally foreign cars are better. For the same reasons you gave to the opposite. I knew a lot of people at my last two jobs who had various foreign cars (Nissan Altima, Audi A4, Nissan Frontier to be exact) who had non-stop problems with the things. The Audi guy was getting his transmission worked on all the time, the Altima had CV joint and alternator issues, the Frontier had 4WD issues. Now, as I mentioned before I think maintenance has a lot to do with it. I know the Audi guy & Altima guy did not do a good job of maintinence. On the flip side of that, my family has owned nothing but GM vehicles my entire life, and gone above and beyond as far as maintinence goes. Every car we've had, we've kept for at least 10 years, and never had any major issues. We had a 15 year old Chevy Lumina with 175,000 miles on it that the only part that was ever replaced was shocks, struts, and alternator (all things you'll replace on any car if you keep it long enough). But I've seen some Luminas the same age that were being held together with duct tape. Now this doesn't make me believe that domestic cars are better. It just doesn't make me believe the hype that foreign cars are some large step above domestic in terms of quality. Or any step up at all really.

As far as Consumer Reports goes, you may accuse me of attacking your source, but I've never been a big fan of them. But specifically regarding what you posted (of course without being able to click the links, as I'm not a subscriber), look at what they're comparing. Do you think it makes sense to compare a Corvette to a Minivan to a 3/4 ton pickup? What exactly is it that makes a Toyota Sienna score 1 point higher than a Corvette??

I'm just curious Christine, other than a list of Consumer Reports opinions or your own personal experiences, is there something else that helps you arrive at your conclusion that foreign > domestic? It just seems to me more of a brand loyalty kind of thing, which I'm sure you'd hate me saying that, but I think we all do it a bit. If someone asks me for a TV recommendation, I usually tell them Samsung. They're a great TV, but so are a few other brands. A Sony or Toshiba might be just as good, but given those three brands I'd choose the Samsung. I've owned a lot of their displays so that's what I go with. People on AVS will chat 'til their blue in the face trying to convince each other that "their" brand is 0.05% better than someone else's. It all just seems silly to me.

I think if you do your research on the specific vehicle you want, buy it brand new, and take good care of it, it doesn't really matter what brand is stamped into the side or what soil it was manufactured on.

[chook]

I agree with Will (yes, I said it). He may be a dumbfuck about a lot of things, but he's right that foreign cars are largely superior to American ones. Ford is decent, but GM and Chrysler suck. Yes, part of their failure is due to the UAW, but their vehicle quality also leaves a lot to be desired.

One of my exes worked for Jeep. She said the problem is that the UAW wouldn't let them use new designs cause they didn't want to learn a new process. Seriously, some people think they should get paid for just showing up and not doing a thing.

The thread made me lol.

[Spectatrix]

I'm just curious Christine, other than a list of Consumer Reports opinions or your own personal experiences, is there something else that helps you arrive at your conclusion that foreign > domestic? It just seems to me more of a brand loyalty kind of thing, which I'm sure you'd hate me saying that, but I think we all do it a bit.

My opinion comes from quality reports from a variety of sources over the years, plus my personal experiences and those of friends & family.

I think that for any given year, you're generally going to find that foreign vehicles are higher quality than domestic, BUT... it's highly dependent on the year/make/model. E.g. (totally made-up example), one year Corollas may be the premier budget compact car, but Camry's suck compared to other cars in its class. Definitely should research the specific cars that you're considering rather than just taking brand name loyalty at face value.

That said, my sense is that Japanese/German *cars* tend to rank higher, whereas domestic generally wins out for trucks. (Not sure about SUVs)

[Spectatrix]

All this reminds me... I need to change my Echo's oil sometime soon.

[Psykopath]

Verrrrrry tempted (and probably will) to buy an older model (89-92) Ford Bronco.
Yes, they are gas-guzzlers. But man they are some hardcore and long lasting vehicles.
I could camp pretty much anywhere, yay!


::EDIT TO BE ON TOPIC::

FUCK UAW!

This post has been edited by Psykopath: Apr 3 2009, 12:55 PM

[Spectatrix]

::EDIT TO BE ON TOPIC::

FUCK UAW!

YEAH!

[pysex]

thread fucking sucks

oh and foreign cars win

[HMWH]

But soft, what light through yonder window breaks?

[Spectatrix]

It is the east, and Juliet is the sun.

[impala454]

this is supposed to be a bitchfest thread, not faggotry

[THECHICKEN]

this is supposed to be a bitchfest thread, not faggotry

Oh stop your bitching

[impala454]

Stop bitching in the bitchfest thread!??!?

[chook]

How about this, for starters: JD Power & Associates 2008 Initial Quality Study

Let's look at the cars.



Porsche - German
Infiniti - Japanese
Lexus - Japanese
Mercedes-Benz - German
Toyota -Japanese
Mercury - US (Ford)
Honda - Japanese
Ford - US
Jaguar - British
Audi - German
Cadillac - US (GM)
Chevrolet - US (GM)
Hyundai - Korean
Pontiac - US (GM)
Lincoln - US (Ford)
Buick - US (GM)

Nah, it's not a comprehensive assessment of quality, but the top 10 is dominated by Japanese and German automakers, with a couple of appearances by Ford. It's not until #11 that you get to GM.

JD Powers is like the industry slut though. Not all cars are rated, and their ratings seem rather arbitrary. If you look at the dependability overall, Lincon beats Honda.

Ranking only 2 models give them the number 1 seed.
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/porsche/2009

[chook]

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. All you have to do is take a few minutes to look at the companies' financials. It's definitely not for a lack of revenue (vehicle sales). If vehicle quality was any part of the reason for the domestic's financial troubles, then how is it they're still selling so many vehicles?

Its like the refinary. You have a base cost, and a cost per production. They still sell alot of cars, its that its not as much as they used to with the same lines with the same base cost. You could be making a shit load of sales and still losing money like Sir Richard Branson.

[impala454]

That's exactly my point. It's not the quality it's the operating costs that are killing them.

[Dogmeat]

Hence I said HAD... And he doesn't own a GM truck anymore... So he HAD one too. Guess you both were driving around klankers.

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh .....

I own a 2005 Chevrolet 2500 HD with the 8.1L/Allison combo .....

[Dogmeat]

I know. But speaking for myself and most people I know who've owned GM, all of us switched to European/Jap and for good reason. Better gas mileage, better build quality, and last 1.5x as long as American garbage

You are a fucking IDIOT if you think Nissan or Toyota builds better trucks than GM or Ford.

The reason your GM fell apart is because you're too dumb to realize you can't rod the shit out of a pickup and have it last.

I have had no problems whatsoever with the last ... I don't know, six or seven Chevy trucks I've had, and I gaurentee I use them _WAY_ more than you ever used yours.

[Dogmeat]

How about this, for starters: JD Power & Associates 2008 Initial Quality Study

Let's look at the cars.



Porsche - German
Infiniti - Japanese
Lexus - Japanese
Mercedes-Benz - German
Toyota -Japanese
Mercury - US (Ford)
Honda - Japanese
Ford - US
Jaguar - British
Audi - German
Cadillac - US (GM)
Chevrolet - US (GM)
Hyundai - Korean
Pontiac - US (GM)
Lincoln - US (Ford)
Buick - US (GM)

Nah, it's not a comprehensive assessment of quality, but the top 10 is dominated by Japanese and German automakers, with a couple of appearances by Ford. It's not until #11 that you get to GM.

*YAWN* @ Magazine racing ...

Christine, really, how much time in different vehicles have you put in?

The BMW parked out back is the biggest peice of shit car I've ever seen in my life. I'd rather have a fucking Grand Am .... Seriously.

Those magazine reviews, such as that and consumer reports, are pure garbage ... they always have been.

[Dogmeat]

Personally I think it's amazing and a tribute to US engineering that US automobiles are as good as they are given the severe quality conrol handicap *cough unions cough* they have with respect to their foreign counterparts ....

[Mommy]

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh .....

I own a 2005 Chevrolet 2500 HD with the 8.1L/Allison combo .....

For some reason I thought you had a Dodge. Were you looking at a RAM at one point while looking for a new truck?

[Dogmeat]

For some reason I thought you had a Dodge. Were you looking at a RAM at one point while looking for a new truck?

I have never even considered buying a Dodge truck in my entire life.

[Mommy]

I have never even considered buying a Dodge truck in my entire life.

I didn't think that sounded like something you would do cause Rams suck, but for some reason I remember thinking "what the hell was he thinking?" hmmm... maybe I'm thinking of someone else.