Boy I sure can't wait for Obama to be our next president... Options

[Dogmeat]

http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/iran_nucl.../29/117217.html

Iran has carried out missile tests for what could be a plan for a nuclear strike on the United States, the head of a national security panel has warned.

Why, we should have a sit down and chitty chat with the people that want to destroy us! That'll change they're minds

Seriously, who in the HELL is going to vote for this idiot?

Wait, don't answer ...

Too many people that can't see the forrest for the trees, and they're going to doom us all.

[pysex]

Like it has been foretold....


The year 2012...the last year of Obama's 4 year term....the world ends.


Apocalypse.

[Seeker]

http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/iran_nucl.../29/117217.html
Why, we should have a sit down and chitty chat with the people that want to destroy us! That'll change they're minds

Seriously, who in the HELL is going to vote for this idiot?

Wait, don't answer ...

Too many people that can't see the forrest for the trees, and they're going to doom us all.

haha, more fabricated news to scare americans... just like iraq's WMD

are you really this stupid?

[Hartmann]

What about his speech to House Democrats in which he said: "I have become a symbol of the possibility of America returning to our best traditions."

[cmac]

at least iran will listen to what obama has to say.

unlike other countries and other candidates.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/07/29/top-ru...ain-has-to-say/

[Hartmann]

at least iran will listen to what obama has to say.

unlike other countries and other candidates.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/07/29/top-ru...ain-has-to-say/

Ahh yes, because this has to do with healthcare?


*Look at the birdie!*

[Dogmeat]

haha, more fabricated news to scare americans... just like iraq's WMD

are you really this stupid?

The world is happy and nice! YAY!

[cmac]

Ahh yes, because this has to do with healthcare?
*Look at the birdie!*

absolutely nothing. because this isn't the healthcare thread.
healthcare thread: http://www.techsans.net/forums/index.php?s...ic=6093&hl=

[Mommy]

Did you all know that health care is two words? Kind of annoying... isn't it?

[impala454]

grammarbitch

[Mommy]

I didn't do it to be a grammar Nazi. I just think it's strange that it's not a compound noun. *shrug*... stupid AP style guide.

[impala454]

damngrammarnazis pointingout compoundwords thatare alreadyaccepted andisnobigdeal.

[Mommy]

Read any news article and I guarantee you, health care will be two words. Any news organization that doesn't follow Associated Press style (with the exception of the New York Times) is fucking lame and gay and stupid and poop.

[impala454]

Read any news article and I guarantee you, health care will be two words. Any news organization that doesn't follow Associated Press style (with the exception of the New York Times) is fucking lame and gay and stupid and poop.

went to CNN, seached healthcare, first article that popped up:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/07/29/martin.ai...iref=newssearch

This is not an issue that will be addressed solely by politicians. It is a national health crisis that will kill a number of people and cost untold millions in healthcare.

also note at the bottom:

Roland S. Martin is an award-winning journalist and CNN contributor.

[Mommy]

That doesn't mean much to be honest (the fact that he is an award winning journalist) because John Kelso is an award-winning writer for the Austin American-Statesman, and his articles are riddled with grammatical errors. He has great articles though so I can see why he has won so many awards and is syndicated. Many times, writers rely on the copy editors to catch their errors.

On another note, I forgot CNN doesn't follow AP style either... mainly because they are an entirely different news entity all together. I was more talking about newspaper than television. CNN has the second most news outlets in the world... behind the Associated Press.

I just prefer AP style, and it uses the most common and preferred grammatical and spelling styles.

[Spectatrix]

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=healthcare

Health care is rapidly becoming a compound noun. It happens. *shrugs*

[impala454]

I was just messin with ya Jessica

though when you challenged me I had to take you up on it

[Mommy]

I was just messin with ya Jessica

though when you challenged me I had to take you up on it

Oh I figured as much... I like debating language though so it entertained me briefly

[pebkac]

http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/iran_nucl.../29/117217.html
Why, we should have a sit down and chitty chat with the people that want to destroy us! That'll change they're minds

Seriously, who in the HELL is going to vote for this idiot?

I don't know. What kind of commie liberal tree hugger would negotiate with Iran?

http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2008/...iran/print.html

Fucking liberals.

[impala454]

do I have to read a very wordy opinion "feature" on salon.com to find out what your point is?

[pebkac]

do I have to read a very wordy opinion "feature" on salon.com to find out what your point is?

No. You could have just read the first sentence:

"Pundits and diplomats nearly got whiplash from the double take they did when George W. Bush sent the No. 3 man in the State Department to sit at a table on July 19 across from an Iranian negotiator, without any preconditions."

If that still doesn't make sense to you, re-read Dogmeat's first post and mentally insert George W. Bush every time you see the word Obama.

[impala454]

It still doesn't make sense. I don't see the word Obama in his first post, and in the article he pasted, the only time I see it is in reference to Obama not supporting a missle defense system (which I'm pretty sure GWB does support). So I guess you'll just have to do it the old fashioned way and just tell us WTF you're tryin to say.

[Spectatrix]

He's saying that people (including Bush & McCain) were giving Obama shit for wanting to negotiate with Iran and North Korea without preconditions. Now Bush is doing just that (with Iran, at least).

This post has been edited by Spectatrix: Aug 1 2008, 08:34 AM

[impala454]

I thought we'd been sending people over there for a while? And I think sending some low ranking official over there isn't really some kind of validation of what Iran's doing. Obama to me seems to represent more of the UN's thinking, talk big but never back it up. To me that's a dangerous line to take, considering our country has been pretty much the only ones with the cajones to do that since what, WW2?

[Spectatrix]

Nah, I don't know all the details, but we have had direct diplomatic talks with Iran in a long while. Here's an interesting video from back in May on the subject: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW6LuYo-6Us

[Mommy]

ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. - Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama said Friday he would be willing to support limited additional offshore oil drilling if that's what it takes to enact a comprehensive policy to foster fuel-efficient autos and develop alternate energy sources.

this man makes no sense

[Billy]

this man makes no sense

He'll 'say' whatever it takes to get elected.

[Mommy]

how would having access to more crude oil foster developing more fuel efficient vehicles... what a jackass

[pebkac]

how would having access to more crude oil foster developing more fuel efficient vehicles... what a jackass

It wouldn't, and I don't think that it's what Obama is saying.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5isOFwdb...TI1gMgD929PG4G0

"Like all compromises, it also includes steps that I haven't always supported," Obama conceded. "I remain skeptical that new offshore drilling will bring down gas prices in the short-term or significantly reduce our oil dependence in the long-term, though I do welcome the establishment of a process that will allow us to make future drilling decisions based on science and fact."

In short, he did it as a compromise with the Republicans, but is more focused on reducing our dependence on oil.

[Mommy]

whatever... man has to appeal to everyone so he is trying to ride the middle of the road now even though he is a leftist nut

[impala454]

The polls say most Americans support drilling offshore, so that's what Obama will say. Guess I can see why he does it but I'd rather stick to my guns than be a wishy-washy flip flopper.

[Psykopath]

whatever... man has to appeal to everyone so he is trying to ride the middle of the road now even though he is a leftist nut

...

So, he's the only politician that tries to ride the fence during an election year?

haha, wow.

[Spectatrix]

I don't think reluctantly agreeing to a compromise really constitutes flip-flopping...

[Dogmeat]

...

So, he's the only politician that tries to ride the fence during an election year?

haha, wow.

No, because of what a whore he is, it's trying to ride like 4 or 5 fences and he's making a bunch of fucking weird ass noises while he's doing it too.

[impala454]

I don't think reluctantly agreeing to a compromise really constitutes flip-flopping...

I think the source of the compromise is what constitutes flip-flopping. I.e. no way in hell he'd have "compromised" if it wasn't the popular thing to do.

[The Fanatic]

All politicians flip flop. Both of these bastards are talking out their asses, pandering to the undecided moderate voters, but nothing will change. As soon as one of them is elected it will be business as usual in Washington D.C.

This post has been edited by The Fanatic: Aug 2 2008, 10:32 AM

[Dogmeat]

All politicians flip flop. Both of these bastards are talking out their asses, pandering to the undecided moderate voters, but nothing will change. As soon as one of them is elected it will be business as usual in Washington D.C.

...Except if Obama gets elected ... if you actually work for a living you will be forced into giving up your money so that illegal immigrants can get free pain pills

[impala454]

All politicians flip flop. Both of these bastards are talking out their asses, pandering to the undecided moderate voters, but nothing will change. As soon as one of them is elected it will be business as usual in Washington D.C.

It doesn't make it right. And I don't even think it necessarily helps get them votes, because yes they grab some votes from some of the undecideds, but they also lose votes from those who don't like the flip flopping and agreed with them before they flip flopped.

And by "both of these bastards" I assume you're referring to obama and mccain. to put mccain even in the same sentence as obama in regards to flip flopping on issues, you've got to be smokin crack.

[Mommy]

McCain hasn't flip flopped too much yet IMO

[The Fanatic]

All politicians are full of lies and "flip flops"

To think otherwise is foolish


To name a few:

McCain was against offshore drilling in 2000 but not anymore

McCain was also originally against the Bush tax cuts

This post has been edited by The Fanatic: Aug 2 2008, 02:03 PM

[Mommy]

Not saying he doesn't, but the degree of his flops pale in comparison to that of Obama's

[The Fanatic]

I think they are equally full of shit *shrugs*

[chook]

I think they are equally full of shit *shrugs*

cause all men are created equal, or sweet and low in some places.

[Mommy]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080802/ap_on_...dential_debates

Oh, Obama, what a stupid fucker you are

[Dogmeat]

All I know is, I'm fucked in this election either way, it's just that if I'm voting for McCain I'm voting for my own money, which is about the only thing I have left in this election I won't lose.

[pebkac]

I think the source of the compromise is what constitutes flip-flopping. I.e. no way in hell he'd have "compromised" if it wasn't the popular thing to do.

I don't understand this. What's wrong with a politician basing his decisions on what the people want?

[Dogmeat]

I don't understand this. What's wrong with a politician basing his decisions on what the people want?

Because mob-mentality leads to ultimate stupidity....

[impala454]

Because mob-mentality leads to ultimate stupidity....

bingo

[pebkac]

Because mob-mentality leads to ultimate stupidity....

So then you disagree with offshore oil drilling proposals?

[impala454]

So then you disagree with offshore oil drilling proposals?

The mob flip flops too much though. We couldn't function as a country if every decision was made by some huge popular vote.

[Oasis]

McCain was against offshore drilling in 2000 but not anymore

OK? Oil was plentiful and gasoline was somewhere around $1.15 a gallon in 2000. Now, in 2008, oil is scarce and gasoline is nearing $4 a gallon. Of course any rational person would have changed their view over 8 years when oil nearly quadruples in price. Offshore drilling wasn't needed in 2000. Now, in 2008, it's nearly a necessity to keep gas prices from ballooning to over $5/gallon and further horsecollaring the nation.

Seriously, you people who discount a candidate because he changes his views about things (or "flip flops," whatever the term is) are complete dumbasses. Times change. People change. Viewpoints change. Popular beliefs change. Economies change. The world changes. I wouldn't vote for a candidate who doesn't flip flop

So why shouldn't a president's opinion change as well? I'd rather have a progressive president who changes his views (or "flip flops") to best suit the people, economy, etc than some ignorant dumbass president with set in stone beliefs who, for example, will never pass legislation for offshore drilling regardless of how badly the economy needs it because he won't "flip flop." So excuse McCain or any other candidate for doing such a reprehensible deed as changing his opinion of something, especially something that will help this country. Back to the drilling example, the destruction of the environment wasn't worth the additional oil reserves we'd get from drilling in 2000. In 2008, the opposite is true. The positive (getting more oil in a time when oil is scarce and hitting record highs/barrel) outweighs the negative (harming an isolated part of our environment).

You people talk about flip flopping like it's on par with torturing defenseless animals or molesting babies. It isn't a bad thing. Remember, if someone in charge hadn't flip flopped, we'd still be fighting a war in Vietnam. What once seemed like a good idea, invading Vietnam, didn't turn out to be such a smart decision. Thank god we had a "flip flopper" to get us out. Ponder that the next time you attack some candidate for changing his views about invading Iraq. Shit changes

[Spectatrix]

The mob flip flops too much though. We couldn't function as a country if every decision was made by some huge popular vote.

Wait, so... the majority isn't always right? Haven't you previously said that it was ok for gay marriage to be banned because the majority of people in the country supported it?

[impala454]

But the majority hasn't flip flopped on that view... ever.

[Mommy]

OK? Oil was plentiful and gasoline was somewhere around $1.15 a gallon in 2000. Now, in 2008, oil is scarce and gasoline is nearing $4 a gallon. Of course any rational person would have changed their view over 8 years when oil nearly quadruples in price. Offshore drilling wasn't needed in 2000. Now, in 2008, it's nearly a necessity to keep gas prices from ballooning to over $5/gallon and further horsecollaring the nation.

Seriously, you people who discount a candidate because he changes his views about things (or "flip flops," whatever the term is) are complete dumbasses. Times change. People change. Viewpoints change. Popular beliefs change. Economies change. The world changes. I wouldn't vote for a candidate who doesn't flip flop

So why shouldn't a president's opinion change as well? I'd rather have a progressive president who changes his views (or "flip flops") to best suit the people, economy, etc than some ignorant dumbass president with set in stone beliefs who, for example, will never pass legislation for offshore drilling regardless of how badly the economy needs it because he won't "flip flop." So excuse McCain or any other candidate for doing such a reprehensible deed as changing his opinion of something, especially something that will help this country. Back to the drilling example, the destruction of the environment wasn't worth the additional oil reserves we'd get from drilling in 2000. In 2008, the opposite is true. The positive (getting more oil in a time when oil is scarce and hitting record highs/barrel) outweighs the negative (harming an isolated part of our environment).

You people talk about flip flopping like it's on par with torturing defenseless animals or molesting babies. It isn't a bad thing. Remember, if someone in charge hadn't flip flopped, we'd still be fighting a war in Vietnam. What once seemed like a good idea, invading Vietnam, didn't turn out to be such a smart decision. Thank god we had a "flip flopper" to get us out. Ponder that the next time you attack some candidate for changing his views about invading Iraq. Shit changes

I understand the McCain flip flop on that issue. Times change. The thing is, though, with Obama times haven't changed. In fact, he said he would support offshore drilling in certain circumstances AFTER oil prices were on the decline again. The man is always one step behind. I want a president who keeps up or is one step ahead. Obama makes no sense on any of his views. He is FOR the situation in Afghanistan, possibly FOR a situation in Iran, but AGAINST the situation in Iraq.... umm ok? What a moron.

[chook]

Man, I can't get into this conversation.

[Billy]

Man, I can't get into this conversation.

Why not?

[chook]

Why not?

i'm flip flopping too much!

[Mommy]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080806/ap_on_...ma_overexposure

touche'

[nickluto]

OK? Oil was plentiful and gasoline was somewhere around $1.15 a gallon in 2000. Now, in 2008, oil is scarce and gasoline is nearing $4 a gallon. Of course any rational person would have changed their view over 8 years when oil nearly quadruples in price. Offshore drilling wasn't needed in 2000. Now, in 2008, it's nearly a necessity to keep gas prices from ballooning to over $5/gallon and further horsecollaring the nation.

Seriously, you people who discount a candidate because he changes his views about things (or "flip flops," whatever the term is) are complete dumbasses. Times change. People change. Viewpoints change. Popular beliefs change. Economies change. The world changes. I wouldn't vote for a candidate who doesn't flip flop

So why shouldn't a president's opinion change as well? I'd rather have a progressive president who changes his views (or "flip flops") to best suit the people, economy, etc than some ignorant dumbass president with set in stone beliefs who, for example, will never pass legislation for offshore drilling regardless of how badly the economy needs it because he won't "flip flop." So excuse McCain or any other candidate for doing such a reprehensible deed as changing his opinion of something, especially something that will help this country. Back to the drilling example, the destruction of the environment wasn't worth the additional oil reserves we'd get from drilling in 2000. In 2008, the opposite is true. The positive (getting more oil in a time when oil is scarce and hitting record highs/barrel) outweighs the negative (harming an isolated part of our environment).

You people talk about flip flopping like it's on par with torturing defenseless animals or molesting babies. It isn't a bad thing. Remember, if someone in charge hadn't flip flopped, we'd still be fighting a war in Vietnam. What once seemed like a good idea, invading Vietnam, didn't turn out to be such a smart decision. Thank god we had a "flip flopper" to get us out. Ponder that the next time you attack some candidate for changing his views about invading Iraq. Shit changes

I liked the beginning of your post, Will. Ill have to disagree about people being wrong for disliking "flip-floppers". There is a difference between changing your opinion on a situation over a long period of time in response to economic, social, and international stability variables and changing your opinion on policy platforms purely to try to garner more votes. Why? I don't know. In my opinion, one just seems more honest and genuine than the other and shows more conviction.

And it always cracks me up when Obama starts out the response to any question as "And it's as I've always said..." yeah...as you've always said. when you've taken every position avaliable, of course you've already said it before...

[Hartmann]

What I do not understand about Obama's position is that he states President Bush needs to open up the reserves while at the same time stating that Americans need to curb their consumption.

You don't curb consumption by providing more of the product.

[impala454]

He keeps saying the dumbest stuff... he mentioned something about tire inflation the other day. gimme a friggin break.

[pebkac]

He keeps saying the dumbest stuff... he mentioned something about tire inflation the other day. gimme a friggin break.

People took Obama a little too literally there. He was basically saying that we could not worry so much about offshore drilling if people would inflate their tires better. And he was right. Proper tire inflation can affect your gas milage, and has been recommended by lots of government officials (including several Republicans). That's not to say that our entire energy policy should be based around inflating tires, and I don't think Obama was trying to say that. At least that's what I pulled from the clip I saw.

What I do not understand about Obama's position is that he states President Bush needs to open up the reserves while at the same time stating that Americans need to curb their consumption.

You don't curb consumption by providing more of the product.

This was definitely a political move that's been used by Democrats before (and I think the Republicans have done it once or twice as well, but I could be wrong). Such a move really wouldn't have any long term effect on gas prices. But it sure does make you look like you want to do something about gas prices.

Kind of like the "gas tax holiday" that Hillary Clinton was proposing. They tried it once before, but gas companies didn't lower their prices any and just pocketed the difference.

[impala454]

People took Obama a little too literally there. He was basically saying that we could not worry so much about offshore drilling if people would inflate their tires better. And he was right. Proper tire inflation can affect your gas milage, and has been recommended by lots of government officials (including several Republicans). That's not to say that our entire energy policy should be based around inflating tires, and I don't think Obama was trying to say that.

That's exactly what he said. His exact words were that we could "save more oil by properly inflating our tires than if we drilled." He's a fucking idiot.

[Mommy]

Some news article I was reading the other day was trying to prove him right. It was dumb.

[pebkac]

That's exactly what he said. His exact words were that we could "save more oil by properly inflating our tires than if we drilled." He's a fucking idiot.

And he was right. Well, ok. Maybe he wasn't right to say that properly inflated tires would save more oil. But underinflated tires would save as much oil as offshore drilling would produce.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive....html?series=19

Will maintaining proper tire pressures make a huge difference in the enormous amount of oil we import? No. But it can make a dent, albeit a very small one. According to the Department of Energy, underinflated tires alone cost the country more than 1.25 billion gal. of gasoline annually—roughly 1 percent of the total consumption of 142 billion gal. According to the Annual Energy Outlook 2007, published by the Energy Information Administration, offshore drilling would increase domestic production of crude oil by only about 1 percent.

[impala454]

horseshit. besides, the point isn't to maintain our current status. it's to make it better. so why isn't Obama recommending inflating tires better AND drilling? The other part of the point is to be producing oil here vs relying on other countries.

Either way, I can't believe you're buying into this stupid shit... Yeah and I bet if people cleaned their injectors and replaced their fuel filters and buying new cars and blah blah blah blah blah we'd gain eleventy billion barrels.

Not to mention, how in the flyin fuck did the DoE determine that 1.25 billion gallons of gas are wasted from underinflated tires? And how many dipshits are going to go overinflate their tires and then die in a car wreck because of Obama's suggestion?