UF Student arrested, tasered, for asking Kerry about Skull & Bones Options

[jonathan83]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6bVa6jn4rpE&...ted&search=

This is messed up. This guy is screaming for help and he gets tasered just for asking questions to Sen. Kerry. This is appalling. You can hear several girls asking the police to stop because he's being tortured by that damn taser. What the hell...


More video after he's led outside: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=3ec_1190097717&p=1

Articles:
http://www.local10.com/news/14138122/detai...ia&psp=news
http://www.local6.com/news/14138039/detail.html
http://www.gainesvillesun.com/article/2007...80325/1007/NEWS

[False Dude]

What was he expecting to happen? The police carry tasers and are unafraid to use them. If you try to resist you will get tasered.

[cmac]

the guy seems ultral liberal.
i'm surprised the conservative response isn't "he deserved it."
seems pretty crazy, but i'm not surprised.

[Seeker]

Tasering someone is not normal procedure unless a subject is resisting arrest or is about to assault an officer. The student was obviously not a threat to anyone and volunteered to leave the building on his on accord but was tasered anyways. All to often police whip out their taser like cowboys and use it in situations when it's not necessary and the taser only makes things worse.

If this had happened in Europe (and has happened in Europe) people from the audience would have beat the fucking shit out of the cops for the unnecessary torture with the taser. Whenever cops get the bully attitude and act like pricks from high school they get the beat down put on them in Europe. People in Europe are not afraid to stand up to police brutality but here in America people are a bunch of sheeple pussies.

[Seeker]

http://onemansblog.com/2007/09/17/the-tase...you-all-submit/

[impala454]

the guy refused to leave, and then fought with the police and resisted arrest. the cops even told him to stop resisting or he would be tasered. he deserved what he got.

[cmac]

the guy refused to leave, and then fought with the police and resisted arrest. the cops even told him to stop resisting or he would be tasered. he deserved what he got.

i'm surprised the conservative response isn't "he deserved it."

oh wait. i should've know.

[Seeker]

the guy refused to leave, and then fought with the police and resisted arrest. the cops even told him to stop resisting or he would be tasered. he deserved what he got.

Where in the video did the guy resist arrest? And since when is tasering the first method employed to subdue someone? Police are supposed to go down the list when attempting to arrest someone, not jump straight to tasering.

Police can employ the following to subdue a subject:
--Physical force
--Serious physical force (strikes and kicks)
--OC (pepper spray, Mace being a common brand)
--Baton
--Taser
--Firearm

[impala454]

Where in the video did the guy resist arrest?

uh, throughout the entire thing

And since when is tasering the first method employed to subdue someone?

it wasn't the first method they used. they told him to leave, he wouldn't leave, they physically tried to remove him, he still wouldn't leave. they got on top of him and tried to cuff him, he still wouldn't leave. i dunno how much more resisting arrest you want.

Police are supposed to go down the list when attempting to arrest someone, not jump straight to tasering.

Police can employ the following to subdue a subject:
--Physical force
--Serious physical force (strikes and kicks)
--OC (pepper spray, Mace being a common brand)
--Baton
--Taser
--Firearm

so, you're upset and say the crowd should have kicked the cops ass, but according to your list here you'd have been happier if they'd beaten the kid and pepper sprayed him instead? (in this case i don't think pepper spray was an option anyways considering the number of people in there sitting close by).

[Hartmann]

He did resist, though I am not sure the taser should have been employed. He should have been escorted out as he was asked to let someone else ask questions and refused.

When he broke the two police officer's grip he probably stepped over the line as they were being pretty civil with the guy up till that point.

Cmac, what's funny is that had it been a conservative questioning Kerry on ethics and the same thing happened, his ass would have probably been tasered as well, then someone else would have said he deserved it.

Did this guy deserve it? Not really, he wasn't a threat. I would think they would have resorted to pushing the guy to the floor, cuffing him, and taking him outside. Those things could have been done without the taser (IMO).

Oh, and screaming "Help!" does not equal a free pass.

[moebary]

he resisted arrest, especially when he got close to the door

they tasered him because he wouldn't let them put handcuffs on him when he was on the floor, you can see his arms flailing, then they tasered him for about 2 sec., or twice 1 sec. each, couldn't tell. then he continued to say "ow" afterwards. dumbass

[impala454]

i thought it was funny how he really believes all this conspiracy stuff and kept crying "omg they're giving me to the government" "they're going to kill me!" "make sure yall ask where i am in a few days!"

[jonathan83]

uh, throughout the entire thing

he had his hands in the air asking "what are you doing?" "why are you arresting me?" and they wouldnt tell him shit.

it wasn't the first method they used. they told him to leave, he wouldn't leave,

.
when did they tell him to leave? look at the beginning of the video, they never said crap to him, they just up and starting cuffing him right after asking about skull and bones.

they physically tried to remove him, he still wouldn't leave. they got on top of him and tried to cuff him, he still wouldn't leave. i dunno how much more resisting arrest you want.

what? they were ON TOP OF HIM. how could he leave? they were tasering him and on top, he was just lying there. of course he couldn't leave.

[moebary]

when he was near the door he tried to get out of the cops hold, which is resisting, and when he was on the floor he wasn't "just lying there", he was flailing his arms about

[cupcake]

what a dildo. he was disturbing the peace and resisting arrest. he's lucky he didn't get knocked upside the head with a baton.

I'll take a taser anyday over OC spray or blunt force. it's not that fuckin bad.

[cmac]

Cmac, what's funny is that had it been a conservative questioning Kerry on ethics and the same thing happened, his ass would have probably been tasered as well, then someone else would have said he deserved it.

sometimes i wonder...

[THECHICKEN]

They cut his micriphone (why im not sure... kerry was even gonna answer it... which i kinda wanted to hear), then he was being escorted out. I don't think it was an arrest until he started causing a scene (yelling etc. and pushing the cops off him).

So when they really start to arrest him (which they didn't need to be doing) i think he was resisting and acting like a pompus ass.... but TAZERING?? When there are SIX police officers holding the guy down and cuffed, is the tazer REALLY necessary? Horrible judgment on the police officers part.
oh and don't the police officers all need to let go of him to tazer him (so no one touching him gets shocked too?)

Oh and lance you are wrong about europe. In the few cases police are attacked by civilians its merely the same as a riot in the united states (lots of poeple with a mob mentality). Soccer games are the easy example, the thuggish nature of the fans is crazy. When i went to a game the police were wearing riot gear, etc. ... and about 100 of them had to be brought INSIDE the playing arena to make sure idiot fans didn't jump the fence over what they thought was a bad call.

Not to mention the fact that places like UK don't have cops carrying guns (so people might be a little braver)... but then again brits aren't allowed to have guns either (which we know you would love)

[cupcake]

So when they really start to arrest him (which they didn't need to be doing) i think he was resisting and acting like a pompus ass.... but TAZERING?? When there are SIX police officers holding the guy down and cuffed, is the tazer REALLY necessary?

of course not, but dude...most cops are pussies. they will always go the easy way. those fat, donut eating fucks aren't going to wrestle anyone when they can use their tools. god forbid they work up their heart rate.

a cop will just as soon shoot your black ass as chase you.

[jonathan83]

on the second video he keeps asking again "why are you arresting me? i didnt do anything wrong" and finally one of the cops say "for inciting a riot"

how the hell was he inciting a riot? he was asking a question.

furthermore, why did they start TOUCHING him in the first place? why couldnt he finish his question? is that normal?

[jonathan83]

one more thing... the police did not inform him that he was under arrest and did not mirandize him while detaining him and electro-shocking him with a taser.

[Epic]

I'll take a taser anyday over OC spray or blunt force. it's not that fuckin bad.

i've gotta agree with this. at least when i was tasered I was functional after 30 seconds as opposed to the 3 hours before I could perform normal things well with OC spray.

[cupcake]

one more thing... the police did not inform him that he was under arrest and did not mirandize him while detaining him and electro-shocking him with a taser.

cops don't have to read you your rights before tazering you...

tazering is simply a means to subdue you for cuffing, at which point they read them.

[cupcake]

i've gotta agree with this. at least when i was tasered I was functional after 30 seconds as opposed to the 3 hours before I could perform normal things well with OC spray.

right. if anyone's ever grabbed a hotwire fence like for cattle, the tazer's fairly similar.

OC feels like a dragon shit fire in your eyes and sucked all the oxygen out of the atmosphere. I'll take a beanbag round from a shotgun over that shit.

[The Fanatic]

A good tasering builds character!!!

[moebary]

haha, I just watched the second video and this guy sounds like any other lunatic who's been arrested on cops

[Epic]

i've been to enough speaking engagements featuring high profile politicians, and you are told at the beginning that security is heightened and that there are rules to follow. After watching the video, it looks like they weren't arresting him at first, just escorting him out for being a disturbance which he was probably warned about.

he is the one who made it into an arrest.

[cupcake]

they shoulda kicked his ass seabass then gone for tea and strumpets...

fatass cops

[Hartmann]

they shoulda kicked his ass seabass then gone for tea and strumpets...

fatass cops

Yes for the Dumb & Dumber lines!

"If I know Mary, she'll invite us right up!"
"You were wearing two pair of gloves the entire time?" - "Yeah, we're in the Rockies"

[cmac]

i fail to see how he was a disturbance.
kerry was about to answer his question.

so he asked slightly heated questions...
and his microphone gets turned off as soon as he mentioned secret societies.

[cupcake]

that john denver is full of shit man...

[Hartmann]

i fail to see how he was a disturbance.
kerry was about to answer his question.

so he asked slightly heated questions...
and his microphone gets turned off as soon as he mentioned secret societies.

If you read it was stated that he had already asked multiple questions and was asked to not continue. He refused and continued to ask.

His mic was shut off and he still continued. The police then were escorting him out and he tried to resist being escorted out. He wasn't placed in cuffs until he resisted.

Have any of you actually been arrested? I have. They do not read you your rights until you are actually placed under arrest. They can put cuffs on you while they try to sort a situation out, I've seen this done multiple times and a few of those they actually let the person go. They just know situations are volatile and that keeping cuffs on someone is an easy way to control it.

Focus on the entire picture and it becomes more clear. Focus too much on a single point and the waters get murky.

[cupcake]

people tend to get mired down in the minutia of civil rights, when they should realize some things are just common fuckin sense.

don't resist the po-po...and you won't get dealt with. I trust cops about as far as I can throw them, thus give them ZERO reason to escalate the situation. I'm all "yessamassa, yessa I'se sits right hurr sir, like a good boy".

but nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo...dildos have to run their sucks and put up a fight.

[jonathan83]

If you read it was stated that he had already asked multiple questions and was asked to not continue. He refused and continued to ask.

His mic was shut off and he still continued. The police then were escorting him out and he tried to resist being escorted out. He wasn't placed in cuffs until he resisted.

At the end he was finished and Kerry even said "i'll answer his question" or something.
You can hear the guy saying something to the effect of "leave me alone I just want to hear him answer"
he was finished, he just wanted to listen to Kerry's answers and they wouldnt even let him.

on the second video he keeps asking again "why are you arresting me? i didnt do anything wrong" and finally one of the cops say "for inciting a riot"

how the hell was he inciting a riot? he was asking a question.

also wanna bump this

[Oasis]

To figure out who's at fault look no further than the picture


A fat, bulldyke woman cop. Probably was a social outcast in high school and college, and now she's lashing back at society because she finally has the legal authority to do so. A ridiculous generalization but $100 bucks says I'm correct. Same goes for fat country bumpkin male cops. One of the Wilco cops around here always picked on the Westwood football players because he didn't make the team 20 years earlier and was jealous of em.

Excuse the guy for moving around when he had 5 rednecks on him tasering him. I know when I tased myself, it caused my body to convulse and twitch on the ground. Kind of hard to stay still when you don't have control over your motor functions for 20-30 seconds. It looked like he was honestly asking why he was being escorted away and the douchebag cops wouldn't tell him. "Because I said so" isn't a valid answer to a question if you're older than 6. I'd be pissed too and probably wouldn't budge until I was given a valid explanation. And if you've ever been subdued by a cop, you know damn well they use as much force as they want. When I was arrested for DWI the dumbfuck cop threw me up against the squad car, cuffed with my hands behind my back then threw me in the backseat. I started squirming because my cuffs were intentionally too tight, and sitting on your cuffed hands is uncomfortable as shit. I wasn't a fucking threat to anyone, the cop was just doing it to fuck with me.

Side note: Last month, I ran by the bar for like 5 seconds. I saw some Wilco bulldyke cop questioning someone she'd pulled over. I had to circle around and park about 10 feet away from her because the place was packed. Got out, heard her ask for the guy's insurance, and when he went to grab it from the center console she wigged out and pulled her gun. Dragged him out of the car and started beating him with the butt of her pistol, even though he wasn't resisting other than squirming around trying to defend himself from some mullet headed fatass dyke cop. Sorry, I'd defend myself as well if I was being beaten. That isn't resisting arrest, that's defending yourself. Maybe if cops don't want people resisting arrest, they shouldn't act like fucking douchebags and arrest people peacefully. He's filing charges against the Williamson County PD (this is nothing new, they're the worst county in TX) and if it goes to trial I get to testify against the cunt

BTW, I have nothing against police as long as they don't overstep their boundary.

[Hartmann]

At the end he was finished and Kerry even said "i'll answer his question" or something.
You can hear the guy saying something to the effect of "leave me alone I just want to hear him answer"
he was finished, he just wanted to listen to Kerry's answers and they wouldnt even let him.
also wanna bump this

Again, I don't care if Kerry said he'd answer it. This guy could sit down and listen to the answer. He was asked to sit down and not ask any other questions, he continued to. What kind of things are we teaching our kids if it is ok to disobey and continue to do something when told not to?

Also, even though IAKAL, the inciting a riot charge would probably stick as he resisted arrest and yelled "help me!" which is comparable to "fire" in a crowded theater.

[Inferia]

I don't know if he deserved it, but that was kinda disturbing for me. I didn't think he was under arrest till 6 cops were on top of him.

I guess if the cops were worried about him inciting a riot before at the meeting, they should really be worried about him inciting a riot now. Good way to taze off the crowd huh?

[cmac]

yelled "help me!" which is comparable to "fire" in a crowded theater.

WHAT!??!?
no. there is no comparison.

[Hartmann]

WHAT!??!?
no. there is no comparison.

http://www.lawyers.com/ask_a_lawyer/q_and_...03&site=537

Though this guy may not have met the criteria for the federal charge, who knows what the local and state laws are regarding inciting a riot.

And yes, there is a comparison. His yelling for help is meant to compel people to intervene on his behalf and possibly cause a riot. Therein lies the comparison.

Also, even if he wasn't inciting a riot I am sure a resisting charge would be applicable (hell, their inciting a riot charge may be the same as a resisting charge). As far as the end of that second video goes, I still don't know if he was considered under arrest or not.

I do agree that the taser was a little much but this guy did need to be removed.

[cmac]

so the next time i help a child on the side of the road that says "help me" i'm inciting a riot?

[Oasis]

so the next time i help a child on the side of the road that says "help me" i'm inciting a riot?

Only if said child is getting beaten down by a bunch of cops

[False Dude]

people tend to get mired down in the minutia of civil rights, when they should realize some things are just common fuckin sense.

don't resist the po-po...and you won't get dealt with. I trust cops about as far as I can throw them, thus give them ZERO reason to escalate the situation. I'm all "yessamassa, yessa I'se sits right hurr sir, like a good boy".

but nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo...dildos have to run their sucks and put up a fight.

ha I was thinking the exact same thing.

[Hartmann]

so the next time i help a child on the side of the road that says "help me" i'm inciting a riot?

No because the child is in need, this guy wasn't. He was also in an enclosed area and was in a volatile situation. Your example is irrelevant.

[Inferia]

so the next time i help a child on the side of the road that says "help me" i'm inciting a riot?

No, you're not inciting a riot, the child is, that's why he should be locked away

[cupcake]

cmac...serious question here...

if you felt you were in the right, would you resist a cop?

[Hartmann]

I think it's interesting that the people who think the cops were in the wrong completely have nothing to say about the guy not listening to what he was told to do.

I've pointed out that this kid was merely being escorted out when he tried to shake off the police and was forced to the floor. I'd much rather be removed than tasered, and if that meant just holding my tongue and then in a normal voice asking the cop why i was removed, then I'd do it.

[cmac]

if i knew. yes.
cause i could sue later

[jonathan83]

I think it's interesting that the people who think the cops were in the wrong completely have nothing to say about the guy not listening to what he was told to do.

I've pointed out that this kid was merely being escorted out when he tried to shake off the police and was forced to the floor. I'd much rather be removed than tasered, and if that meant just holding my tongue and then in a normal voice asking the cop why i was removed, then I'd do it.

but this guy honestly didnt know why they were escorting him out, thats why he kept asking them.
if you were shopping for groceries and all of a sudden a bunch of cops start dragging you out the store and trying to cuff you, what would you do? would you try to resist or just go quietly??

[cupcake]

go quietly.

I was an ultra rebellious skate punk as a teenager and caused myself and my parents a lot more grief than was necessary. mouthing off to cops, and telling them "I had the right" and whatnot. at the time, I felt justified...but in retrospect, I realized I was just a dumbass.

rocking the boat rarely does anything but capsize the fucker.

you're better off doing what is told/asked, then once the transgression has passed going through the proper channels and means of rectifying the situation in which you believe you were wronged.

best part is...your ass won't get tazed.

[Hartmann]

but this guy honestly didnt know why they were escorting him out, thats why he kept asking them.
if you were shopping for groceries and all of a sudden a bunch of cops start dragging you out the store and trying to cuff you, what would you do? would you try to resist or just go quietly??

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/9/18/10649/5334

Apparently he did know why he was getting escorted out.

And that's from a left leaning publication.

[Testm0nkey]

but this guy honestly didnt know why they were escorting him out, thats why he kept asking them.
if you were shopping for groceries and all of a sudden a bunch of cops start dragging you out the store and trying to cuff you, what would you do? would you try to resist or just go quietly??

you believe that? guy obviously knew why he was being taken out. he purposefully was causing a disruption by yelling, not letting anyone else ask questions, never giving time for anyone to answer. they turned the mic off and repeatedly asked him to sit down and let others ask questions. hes just a looney

you think if Bush did a campus speech and a lunatic stood up adn started screaming at him and pushing his way around everyone (which this dude did)... actually he'd probably get shot

[Inferia]

you think if Bush did a campus speech and a lunatic stood up adn started screaming at him and pushing his way around everyone (which this dude did)... actually he'd probably get shot

I guess we should be glad that he's not full of bullets by now?

[cupcake]

an example of going along with it when you are in the right...

we had just finished a training raid and the unit was at the boat ramp cleaning and breaking down zodiacs. the plt sgt wanted to get the weapons back to the armory while that was going on so we could get cut on liberty asap, as we were all cold, exhausted, and hungry.

only problem was, the armory was 30 miles away and we had no hummers available. well my blazer was in the parking lot so we loaded up all the weapons in the back and headed off. we get pulled over for no reason by an MP (they do that) and he sees 40 rifles and machine guns in the blazer, draws his weapon, and orders us out and face down on the asphalt. we oblidge and just keep our mouths shut.

now this dumbfuck was a boot-ass lance corporal and obviously didn't know the base regs which stated that staff NCOs can travel with issued weapons in privately owned vehicles...but we didn't argue.

he called it in and several MPs show up and basically call the kid a dipshit, but if we hadn't just done what he said, I have no doubt he would have fired on us. I was more scared at that point, with his beretta in my face, than I was getting shot at overseas.

[cmac]

no confrontation was needed then.
it looks as if he waited for Kerry to finish answering another person's question.
the kid began to ask his question and then someone pulled his mic.
he asked why, then he's jumped.

maybe if the popo would have let him finish asking his question, and Kerry answered like he said he would there would've been no problem.

he even brought a book. it's obvious he was serious about having his questions answered rather than causing a "riot"

[Hartmann]

no confrontation was needed then.
it looks as if he waited for Kerry to finish answering another person's question.
the kid began to ask his question and then someone pulled his mic.
he asked why, then he's jumped.

maybe if the popo would have let him finish asking his question, and Kerry answered like he said he would there would've been no problem.

he even brought a book. it's obvious he was serious about having his questions answered rather than causing a "riot"

I cannot believe you are justifying the guy because it was a "popo" and because he was carrying a book. So I guess I'm immune from not being rude if I carry a book? This guy didn't have to cut, he could have not had his questioned answered and waited his damn turn. If he didn't get a turn, so be it.

[cmac]

an automatic weapon held in my face changes a few things in how i/or anyone might react to a situation.

[cmac]

I cannot believe you are justifying the guy because it was a "popo" and because he was carrying a book. So I guess I'm immune from not being rude if I carry a book? This guy didn't have to cut, he could have not had his questioned answered and waited his damn turn. If he didn't get a turn, so be it.

exactly, but me cutting in the lunch line in 2nd grade didn't justify a tazering.
so the guy was a jackass. tons of people are at political speakings.

This post has been edited by cmac: Sep 18 2007, 01:20 PM

[Inferia]

I was just talking to my friend about the event. He said his cousin who is on the SWAT team wouldn't taser anyone. He had to take one for the team, afterwards he said that it hurt, he'd rather take a bullet. I don't know so much about that part, but perhaps the cops don't know how much it hurts to get tasered. Perhaps cops should get tasered first so they'd understand how using a tool/weapon like the taser can effect someone.

[Hartmann]

exactly, but me cutting in the lunch line in 2nd grade didn't justify a tazering.
so the guy was a jackass. tons of people are at political speakings.

When you are asked to move, then leave, and both times refuse, then you resist being escorted out, yes, you deserve something more than a "we're sorry". Again, I think a quick putting on of the cuffs would have been fine, but the cops felt right in tasering him.

And, this guy wasn't tasered right off the bat. He wasn't asked, then tasered.

He was asked, refused. Asked again, refused again. Taken a hold of and escorted out. He resisted. He was thrown to the ground. He continued to resist. He was tasered.

Don't try to throw people off the scent here cmac by implying this guy never had a chance. He did and he forfeited it.

[cmac]

I was just talking to my friend about the event. He said his cousin who is on the SWAT team wouldn't taser anyone. He had to take one for the team, afterwards he said that it hurt, he'd rather take a bullet. I don't know so much about that part, but perhaps the cops don't know how much it hurts to get tasered. Perhaps cops should get tasered first so they'd understand how using a tool/weapon like the taser can effect someone.

i think i saw something somewhere that they have to be tazed with one before they can carry one.

[Seeker]

I think someone should track down the bulldykes that tasered that poor kid and then taser the hell out of the bulldykes.

[cupcake]

what? I'm pretty sure cops get tazered as part of their qual. if they don't then they are way behind the marine's riot training.

we did as part of our "tazer qual".

same with "OC qual"...it consists of just standing there like a doofus and getting hosed in the face.

[cupcake]

i think i saw something somewhere that they have to be tazed with one before they can carry one.

I'm pretty sure that is the case.

I don't know what inferia's "friend's cousin swat cop" is talking about.

[cmac]

ok i watched it again and this is what i see.
when he says secret society the mic goes off and the police grab him. (no justification)
he raises his hands in the air and asks what they're doing. (no force from him)
the big cop picks him up and carries him towards the door. (not justified)
big cop throws guy to ground.
continues to ask what he's done and why this is happening. asks for help.
says "when you get off of me i'll leave"

at this point they should have got off of him and let him walk out the door.

[Hartmann]

ok i watched it again and this is what i see.
when he says secret society the mic goes off and the police grab him. (no justification)
he raises his hands in the air and asks what they're doing. (no force from him)
the big cop picks him up and carries him towards the door. (not justified)
big cop throws guy to ground.
continues to ask what he's done and why this is happening. asks for help.
says "when you get off of me i'll leave"

at this point they should have got off of him and let him walk out the door.

So you didn't read the first hand account eh?

Before they cut the mic off (which is pretty much where the video starts), he had been asked, then told multiple times to let the original person speak. Kerry was kind enough to answer the first person's question, then was going to answer this guy's question, then he just rambled on about the secret society, (where the video starts), then he gets escorted out.

The police grab him, start escorting him out, he raises his hands, which is technically resisting as he was trying to forcibly remove the police from his arms.

You want justification but in this case the cops were doing what they were asked (according to the first hand accounts) by simply escorting him out. I've seen people escorted out of places before by police and it's no big deal until you start mouthing off and trying to get the cops hands off of you.

He wasn't going to walk out the door. He ran down the aisle (again, first hand accounts) to get to the mic when he realized that not everyone's questions were going to get asked because of time constraints. He took the mic from someone (not justified, to use your words).


Can you honestly tell me that you stick up for this guy simply because you think he was wronged? When are we going to stop making exceptions for people and just face the fact that if you can't be civil, why should others act in a civil way toward you. Gone are the days of respect. It's all about questioning authority and attempting to stand up against it.

You know, the more my girlfriend and I talk about having kids at some point, the more I think about how I'd raise them. What I do in moderation they will imitate in excess. If I am disrespectful to a cop or a teacher, they are sure to do it 10x more. The less we respect each other, the worse it will get.

All this guy in the video had to do was accept the fact that his question wasn't going to get answered and go on with life. Instead he had to run down and try to get it answered, which is self-importance to the utmost.

[impala454]

damn i missed a whole page just bc the power went out for an hour or so?

he had his hands in the air asking "what are you doing?" "why are you arresting me?" and they wouldnt tell him shit.

he wasn't leaving, and he wasn't letting the cops remove hime, and the cops are not required to answer your questions

when did they tell him to leave? look at the beginning of the video, they never said crap to him, they just up and starting cuffing him right after asking about skull and bones.

from what i heard on the news kerry waved at the cops and actually asked them to remove him (apparently not audible on that vid)

what? they were ON TOP OF HIM. how could he leave? they were tasering him and on top, he was just lying there. of course he couldn't leave.

when they were on top of him, they were trying to cuff him, but he kept flailing his arms around not letting them cuff him.

[impala454]

hah hartman what'd you get arrested for?

[Hartmann]

hah hartman what'd you get arrested for?

Assault, inciting a riot, and assault to a law enforcement officer.

All charges were dismissed. Did spend a few nights in a cell though.

[impala454]

lol they played it some more, wow this guy sounds like such a little pussy bitch... "OOWW OWWW HELP ME HELP ME !!! WAAAH"

[cmac]

i read it. him being a jackass before during or after the video doesn't justify a beating or a tazering. they obviously gave him permission to speak, and then were like "no never mind lets just beat him"

when the video starts it shows him standing there waiting for kerry to finish answering questions. he doesn't charge the mic. just waits.

show me where he grabs the mic from someone:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqAVvlyVbag...%2F125041%2F427

yes, i stick up for him because i believe he was wronged. apparantly the new U.S. attitude is seeing a small incident and immediately resorting to violence. we now end up in wars over situations like this.

skateboard guy skated on my sidewalk. beat him down!!!
man wants to ask man question. raises voice. beat him down!!!
sadam is a mean person. beat him down!!

gone are the days of rational thinking.

and the fact that his questions wasn't going to get answered?? it was. kerry began to answer it, then he was thrown to the floor.

[impala454]

Assault, inciting a riot, and assault to a law enforcement officer.

All charges were dismissed. Did spend a few nights in a cell though.

shouldn't have been askin clinton how good the BJ was!

i read it. him being a jackass before during or after the video doesn't justify a beating or a tazering

he didn't get tasered because he was a jackass, he got tasered for resisting arrest.

[impala454]

the sean hannity radio show is about to have one of the witnesses live in a few mins

[jonathan83]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/9/18/10649/5334

Apparently he did know why he was getting escorted out.

And that's from a left leaning publication.

they still should have let him hear what Kerry had to say.
it doesnt matter if its left-leaning or right-leaning. i dont lean left if thats what you're saying... and i was talking to one of my super right-winged friend who also agreed with me. this isnt a case of right vs left.

you believe that?

i was just stating a hypothetical situation.

[impala454]

dude once you're getting arrested, there's no "oh well let me do this real quick first".

[jonathan83]

CNN said they're going to have the actual dude on air at 8. not sure if thats ET or CT.

[impala454]

you can listen to this radio show right now, they're talking about it and about to have one of the witnesses here in a min

http://www.ktrh.com/pages/frame-seanhannity.htm

[Hartmann]

i read it. him being a jackass before during or after the video doesn't justify a beating or a tazering. they obviously gave him permission to speak, and then were like "no never mind lets just beat him"

when the video starts it shows him standing there waiting for kerry to finish answering questions. he doesn't charge the mic. just waits.

show me where he grabs the mic from someone:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqAVvlyVbag...%2F125041%2F427

Again, did you read the thing? The person says "the video starts after he had already made a scene". The guy had already run to the front to get his question asked. The video cameras come out after people realize that this guy is not listening.

Kerry obliged this guy according to that page I linked to but answered the original person's question first. To which this guy started rambling again. At which point he was removed.

Rational thinking? Should rational thinking be done on both sides? This guy was "irrational" by just ignoring the premise that he may not get his question answered. He was irrational by jumping the line. He was irrational by not listening to police.

It runs both ways.

This isn't Rodney King here. This isn't a skater punk who is actively trying to disobey the law. This is just an asshat trying to get a question answered out of turn. Sure, Kerry started to answer, does that mean this kid was right?

A guy ran from the police because he doesn't think he has a license. He gets caught and they find the license on him. Is he justified to run?

[cmac]

i fail to see resisting arrest being charged at and raising your hands in the air and then being taken down.

[Hartmann]

i fail to see resisting arrest being charged at and raising your hands in the air and then being taken down.

You obviously don't understand the law then.

When a cop has his hands on you, you don't try to remove his hands. That's resisting. I tried the same thing and had an assaulting a law enforcement official charge added to my resisting charge.

[jonathan83]

Seems like Hannity is for the dude. He's talking about how college campus needs more free speech, etc.

[impala454]

well you missed the rest of his talk about it

[cmac]

Again, did you read the thing? The person says "the video starts after he had already made a scene". The guy had already run to the front to get his question asked. The video cameras come out after people realize that this guy is not listening.

yes i read the whole thing. again, cutting in line doesn't warrant a tazer or a beatdown.

Kerry obliged this guy according to that page I linked to but answered the original person's question first. To which this guy started rambling again. At which point he was removed.

kerry seemed to be finished with the first guys question. then the guy begins his question. no interruption. he was given an opportunity to speak.

Rational thinking? Should rational thinking be done on both sides? This guy was "irrational" by just ignoring the premise that he may not get his question answered. He was irrational by jumping the line. He was irrational by not listening to police.

he was irrational by cutting in line and being a moron about it.
it was also irrational to beat him down for it.
he was listening to police. they gave him a chance to speak. he did. he was attacked.

his is just an asshat trying to get a question answered out of turn. Sure, Kerry started to answer, does that mean this kid was right?

actually yes. he was given an opportunity by the people in charge to ask the question. regardless of what happened before. he was interrupted, unprovoked, by being drug away.

A guy ran from the police because he doesn't think he has a license. He gets caught and they find the license on him. Is he justified to run?

no. but this guy didn't try to run.

using your analogy, the guy doesn't show the license, and the police beat him and taze him to make him give it to them.
that's this situation.

[cmac]

You obviously don't understand the law then.

When a cop has his hands on you, you don't try to remove his hands. That's resisting. I tried the same thing and had an assaulting a law enforcement official charge added to my resisting charge.

i think it's impossible to remove a cops hands from your body if your hands are held straight in the air.

[impala454]

yes i read the whole thing. again, cutting in line doesn't warrant a tazer or a beatdown.

why do you keep saying this? he wasn't tasered for cutting in line, he was tasered for resisting arrest. he was arrested for refusing to leave. it's pretty damned simple.

[Hartmann]

i think it's impossible to remove a cops hands from your body if your hands are held straight in the air.

He breaks the hold on him does he not? That is resisting. Plain and simple.

Talk to a cop. It doesn't matter if they are just holding your arm to walk you to a car, if you remove their hands from you, you are a) assaulting an officer b ) resisting c) both.

[jonathan83]

is it over?

[cmac]

why do you keep saying this? he wasn't tasered for cutting in line, he was tasered for resisting arrest. he was arrested for refusing to leave. it's pretty damned simple.

i keep saying it cause i'm replying to hartman mentioning it.
i don't care what happened before the video. he was obviously given an opportunity to speak with no confrontation and that's where the video starts.

so our disagreement is that he was resisting arrest.
i fail to see being tackled resisting arrest.

[Oasis]

He breaks the hold on him does he not? That is resisting. Plain and simple.

Talk to a cop. It doesn't matter if they are just holding your arm to walk you to a car, if you remove their hands from you, you are a) assaulting an officer b ) resisting c) both.

They weren't arresting him though, they were only removing him

[cmac]

i don't care what the law is.
if the law says not to put your hands in the air when being forcefully rammed into the ground by the police then the law and all the cartoons are wrong.

[Hartmann]

he was listening to police. they gave him a chance to speak. he did. he was attacked.
actually yes. he was given an opportunity by the people in charge to ask the question. regardless of what happened before. he was interrupted, unprovoked, by being drug away.
no. but this guy didn't try to run.

using your analogy, the guy doesn't show the license, and the police beat him and taze him to make him give it to them.
that's this situation.

How do you know any of this? According to the account the guy was allowed to speak but then asked to move along. He continued and was again asked. Then the cops asked him to move it along. Then he was drug away.

No, he didn't run. But he did try to get away from the police, hence them pulling on his shirt as he tried to break their grasp.

[cupcake]

if that kid wasn't resisting the cops, I'll suck someone's dick.

[Hartmann]

They weren't arresting him though, they were only removing him

Doesn't matter. If you are in the hands of a police officer and forcibly remove the hands (as did this guy) it's resisting or assault, depending on how nice the cop is.

[False Dude]

How did he not resist? After the dude had to practically pick him up and carry him to the back of the auditorium he gets lose and tries to run back towards back past them at which point they take him to the ground.

[impala454]

if that kid wasn't resisting the cops, I'll suck someone's dick.

i loled

[FORSAKENR320]

yea. i bonded out a guy yesterday for "assault on a public servant"

the guy was being cuffed and accidently stepped on the cops foot.

its bullshit, but the cops can do it

[Inferia]

and usually in this type of a situation, you're warrant a taser?

[impala454]

yea. i bonded out a guy yesterday for "assault on a public servant"

the guy was being cuffed and accidently stepped on the cops foot.

its bullshit, but the cops can do it

yeah but what was he bein cuffed for?

[Hartmann]

Also, from the video you posted cmac, you can't tell what is happening.

You can see in the videos that his questioning gets kind of inappropriate, so somebody cut his mic. Instead of shutting up, he starts yelling and making an even bigger scene.

From the Daily Kos article. When he starts yelling, the police remove him. Kerry says "I'll answer his question". Apparently someone was telling the cops to remove this guy because they don't just start throwing people out for no reason.

In your video, he starts pulling away from the cops even with his "hands in the air". He can try to play the innocent, look at me, police brutality card all he wants but if he had just gone along with it they probably would have led him outside, let him go and his video still would have been all over the internet. Instead he just looks like an idiot.

I guess he could consider himself lucky that he doesn't live somewhere like Germany where they'll just tear gas your ass, no questions asked.

[cupcake]

the fact is...that I think some are overlooking...not whether the kid had the RIGHT to speak, whether or not Kerry was going to answer his question, whether or not the cops were overstepping their bounds, whether or not condoleeza is a dyke...none of that matters.

all that matters is, the cops were trying to subdue/escort the kid and he put up a fight. that is an automatic beatdown in cop terms. period.

[cmac]

even if he was told to ask the question and leave, they didn't even let him get that far.
he was cut off mid sentence.
i interpret "ask the question then leave" as: ask question. finish question. listen to answer. leave

[Hartmann]

In the video that cmac posted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqAVvlyVbag...%2F125041%2F427

At around the 1:48 mark he resists. It's clear.