Student Arrested, For disturbing essay Options

[The Fanatic]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/27/student.e...t.ap/index.html

[schwab]

my girlfriend who is a english teacher in middle school even thought that was bullshit....

[psidancer]

Defense attorney Dane Loizzo said Allen Lee has never been disciplined in school and signed Marine enlistment papers last week.

Which goes to prove you can get good grades and still end up in Iraq....



*ba dum bum*

[GOB]

common sense > book smarts


what kind of a retard would write something like this for a class? whether or not he was told he could write anything he wanted, give me a fucking break.

[THECHICKEN]

Dude, i want to fire 2 p90's at the same time. That'd be fun as hell.

[James]

Which goes to prove you can get good grades and still end up in Iraq....
*ba dum bum*

You make it sound as though it was his only option or that it's a bad thing. Why for?

Anyway, if Congress gets its way, he probably wouldn't finish training in time to deploy to Iraq since he's still in high school.

[James]

Also, agree that the decision of the school was excessive.

[Spectatrix]

And so it begins. The fucktard in Virginia wrote "disturbing" 1-act plays, so now anybody who writes something deemed "disturbing" is going to be suspended, pulled out of school, arrested, sent to counseling, etc. etc. etc.

[Mommy]

Kids need to learn that their words and actions have consequences and that there are boundaries. I agree with the punishment.

[Rocky]

Kids need to learn that their words and actions have consequences and that there are boundaries. I agree with the punishment.

Students were told to "write whatever comes to your mind. Do not judge or censor what you are writing," according to a copy of the assignment.

[Mommy]

I know. I can read. I went to a private Baptist school that didnt tolerate stupid shit like that. I like feeling safe at school, and I felt safe. Kids and teachers just dont feel safe anymore.

[Rocky]

I know. I can read. I went to a private Baptist school that didnt tolerate stupid shit like that. I like feeling safe at school, and I felt safe. Kids and teachers just dont feel safe anymore.

Thats not the point at all. The point is, the students were explicitly told to write what is on their minds without any censorship. You can read - but can you understand and interpret ?


I definitely think that essays for school should not be about going on a killing spree. However, when you tell students, to write, anything that comes to their minds without censorship - what do you expect ! Sure you could do this a million times and most people won't write about subject matter that is violent and scary, but any teacher with half an overflowed toilet's worth of shit fragments for brains should know the possibilities.


What if in an offshoot chance a child uses such an assignment as a true cry for help ? Didn't you have compassion in a sense for Cho because he had problems and it seemed that nobody was helping him ?

At the most they should have talked to the student and say that they felt concerned with his paper and they want to make sure things are going ok for him.


Or explicitly mention guidelines in assignments.


I had a teacher request an essay one day in form of a petition for an inclass assignment. For us to write in regards to a cause of any kind. I wrote for the eradication of all religions on this planet. She was pissed at me and gave me a C-, if even that...I don't recall specifically. I didn't get in trouble, but it was sure stupid to see that my instructor was being biased on subject matter rather than the actual quality of my paper [and yes I was an A student].


If you want to feel safe, then stop going to school by around 8th grade. By then we were using the sharp compass in math classes. I was also big enough that I know I could effectively stab that into the bodies of multiple people before any security could get there. In Chemistry we had tons of flammable and explosive chemicals on hand. Safety is an illusion we all try our hardest to live in and feel.

[Seeker]

You can read - but can you understand and interpret ?

ice burn

no she can't, just look at the rape thread

[FORSAKENR320]

Thats not the point at all. The point is, the students were explicitly told to write what is on their minds without any censorship. You can read - but can you understand and interpret ?

the more jessica talks in these threads, the more she convinces me that women should be treated the same as horses. breed them for good genetics, develop some good bloodstock.... but lock them in a wooden cage until you wanna take them out for a ride.

[Seeker]

lol we give jessica such a hard time

sometimes i almost feel bad

[FORSAKENR320]

lol we give jessica such a hard time

sometimes i almost feel bad

don't get me wrong... i greatly enjoy the girls company in person. but our e-personas clash

[Mommy]

You can read - but can you understand and interpret ?

Yes, I understand and I just interpret it differently than you do.

If you tell a young child that they can play any game that they want to play...that means any game within reason. No strip poker and shit like that. In this case, the teacher wanted the students to be creative. Write anything their imagination brings to mind.... there are unsaid limits though. The student knew this. He was just trying to test boundaries. Thats cool, though, if you want to throw low blows to get your point across. I expect that from idiots like Brandon, but not from you.

[Mommy]

lol we give jessica such a hard time

sometimes i almost feel bad

Im the one that's stupid enough to stick around here. What ya'll say doesn't bother me. In fact, most of it is either funny or entertains me.

[Divergent Realit...]

Yes, I understand and I just interpret it differently than you do.

If you tell a young child that they can play any game that they want to play...that means any game within reason. No strip poker and shit like that. In this case, the teacher wanted the students to be creative. Write anything their imagination brings to mind.... there are unsaid limits though. The student knew this. He was just trying to test boundaries. Thats cool, though, if you want to throw low blows to get your point across. I expect that from idiots like Brandon, but not from you.

theres a bold word in that statement that makes all the difference. if the teacher says to write whatever comes to mind, the students are expected to do so. the teacher did not say 'write whatever you want, withing reason.' anything that is an unsaid limit is unknown unless shared. just like teaching a child what is 'bad' they have no clue what you consider 'bad' until you program your version of 'bad' into them.

[Mommy]

I think you all are ignorant to how much a teenager knows the difference between right and wrong. Quit making this kid out to be an innocent victim. He knew what he was doing....pushing limits. Its against the law to make threats. He made a threat. Ignorance is not an excuse.

[Divergent Realit...]

teenagers do indeed know limits. i work around them every week.

they also tend to take things literally quite a bit. analytical depth is not something the average teenager is known for.

so maybe we can stop polarizing and realize i am right.

[Mommy]

teenagers do indeed know limits. i work around them every week.

they also tend to take things literally quite a bit. analytical depth is not something the average teenager is known for.

so maybe we can stop polarizing and realize i am right.

again, underestimating teenagers. yeah, analytical depth isnt their strong point, but this isnt something too deep. "hmm write anything I want? ok... ill write about killing people cuz she said ANYTHING and it will be funny to see her reaction when i write this cuz she cant do anything about it cuz she said ANYTHING." Seriously, ridiculous. Kids must know that there are consequences for their actions. The word "anything" in my opinion has always constituted an unsaid "within reason". When I was in jr high and high school, we were given writing assignments where the teacher said "anything" and none of us were stupid enough to pull shit like this. Kids will be intelligent when it is demanded of them. Quit giving kids every excuse in the book to act ignorant.

[Divergent Realit...]

i dunno. one of the younger asshats at the store did the exact same shit in his creative writing class. only instead of writing about running around in class killing things. it was sci-fi guys in red armor with axes hacking apart people.

how different is it?

[cupcake]

oh I am quite certain that guy "knew" what he was doing was wrong when he wrote it...he intentionally did it to push the envelope and create a stir...

which makes his arrest all the gayer. a true nutcase wouldn't write something so blatantly controversial so soon after the worst school shooting in history.

it's a harmless paper. he's just trying to fuck some shit up or start a fight. he'll make a fine marine.

[Mommy]

i dunno. one of the younger asshats at the store did the exact same shit in his creative writing class. only instead of writing about running around in class killing things. it was sci-fi guys in red armor with axes hacking apart people.

how different is it?

he used an out of body character so it seemed more imaginary than a statement of intent.

oh I am quite certain that guy "knew" what he was doing was wrong when he wrote it...he intentionally did it to push the envelope and create a stir...

which makes his arrest all the gayer. a true nutcase wouldn't write something so blatantly controversial so soon after the worst school shooting in history.

it's a harmless paper. he's just trying to fuck some shit up or start a fight. he'll make a fine marine.

I just think there should be consequences.

[cupcake]

such as ruining his military career before it ever started?

He's been kicked out of the DEP (the military status thingee you are in before you go to bootcamp) as a result of this arrest.

[Divergent Realit...]

reproduction

a place with the paper.

Blood sex and Booze. Drugs Drugs Drugs are fun. Stab, Stab, Stab, S…t…a…b…, poke. "So I had this dream last night where I went into a building, pulled out two P90s and started shooting everyone…, then had sex with the dead bodies. Well, not really, but it would be funny if I did." Umm, yeah, what to wright about…… I'm leaving to join the Marines and I really don't give a [expletive] about my academics, so why does the only class that's complete [expletive], happen to be the only required class…enough said. The model citizen would stay around to vote in new board member to change the 4 years of English policy, but no one really stays around to vote for that kind of local crap, so whoever gets there name on the Ballet with a pretty face gets to do what the [expletive] ever they want with local ordinance. A person is smart, but people are dumb selfish animals. We can't make rules for ourselves so we vote others to do it for us, but we can't even do that right, I meen seriously, Bush for President? And our other option was John Kerry who claimed to parktake in Vietnam Special Forces missions that haven't been declassified…. [expletive]. So Power Flower Super Mario. Pudge, hook, rot, dismember "Fresh Meat." Most new/young teachers are laid back, and cooperative with students as feedback and input into the curriculum and atmosphere. My current English teacher is a control freak intent on setting a gap between herself and her students like a 63 year old white male fortune 500 company CEO, and a illegal immigrant. If CG was a private catholic school, I could understand, but wtf is her problem. And baking brownies and rice crispies does not make up for it, way to try and justify yourself as a good teacher while underhandidly looking for complements on your cooking. No quarrel on you qualifications as a writer, but as a teacher, don't be surprised on inspiring the first cg shooting.

[cupcake]

OH SHIT it's all clear now...

they got him cause he's another chinaman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mommy]

such as ruining his military career before it ever started?

He's been kicked out of the DEP (the military status thingee you are in before you go to bootcamp) as a result of this arrest.

ok well that kinda sucks. thats taking the punishment too far, but i guess they have to set the example with someone

[GOB]

i hope he enjoys his out-of-court settlement check

[Mommy]

don't get me wrong... i greatly enjoy the girls company in person. but our e-personas clash

yeah, but thats cuz you a bizzzznatch

[FORSAKENR320]

yeah, but thats cuz you a bizzzznatch

get back in the kitchen whore

[Mommy]

get back in the kitchen whore

You smell

[FORSAKENR320]

Blood sex and Booze. Drugs Drugs Drugs are fun. Stab, Stab, Stab, S…t…a…b…, poke. "So I had this dream last night where I went into a building, pulled out two P90s and started shooting everyone…, then had sex with the dead bodies. Well, not really, but it would be funny if I did." Umm, yeah, what to wright about…… I'm leaving to join the Marines and I really don't give a [expletive] about my academics, so why does the only class that's complete [expletive], happen to be the only required class…enough said. The model citizen would stay around to vote in new board member to change the 4 years of English policy, but no one really stays around to vote for that kind of local crap, so whoever gets there name on the Ballet with a pretty face gets to do what the [expletive] ever they want with local ordinance. A person is smart, but people are dumb selfish animals. We can't make rules for ourselves so we vote others to do it for us, but we can't even do that right, I meen seriously, Bush for President? And our other option was John Kerry who claimed to parktake in Vietnam Special Forces missions that haven't been declassified…. [expletive]. So Power Flower Super Mario. Pudge, hook, rot, dismember "Fresh Meat." Most new/young teachers are laid back, and cooperative with students as feedback and input into the curriculum and atmosphere. My current English teacher is a control freak intent on setting a gap between herself and her students like a 63 year old white male fortune 500 company CEO, and a illegal immigrant. If CG was a private catholic school, I could understand, but wtf is her problem. And baking brownies and rice crispies does not make up for it, way to try and justify yourself as a good teacher while underhandidly looking for complements on your cooking. No quarrel on you qualifications as a writer, but as a teacher, don't be surprised on inspiring the first cg shooting.

ok, after reading what he wrote, i think the teacher purpsoely tried to get him in trouble. seems like there is a personal conflict between him and his teacher, who gave him the assignment. seems like he was purposely trying to be a dick to her, and she stooped to his level and decided to play victim in order to get him in serious trouble (alex and i are familiar with a certain female pulling this on both of us)

[FORSAKENR320]

You smell

no you smell

[cupcake]

agreed.

I had cuntass teachers that hated me and vice versa who would have called the cops on me in a heartbeat had I given them the ammo...

[FORSAKENR320]

agreed.

I had cuntass teachers that hated me and vice versa who would have called the cops on me in a heartbeat had I given them the ammo...

if it goes to court, he'll be dropped. any lawyer barely worth his salt will notice that and tear her apart for it. especially with enough witnesses (students) to confirm she said to "write anything, without concern for censorship"

[Rocky]

Yes, I understand and I just interpret it differently than you do.

If you tell a young child that they can play any game that they want to play...that means any game within reason. No strip poker and shit like that. In this case, the teacher wanted the students to be creative. Write anything their imagination brings to mind.... there are unsaid limits though. The student knew this. He was just trying to test boundaries. Thats cool, though, if you want to throw low blows to get your point across. I expect that from idiots like Brandon, but not from you.

No you never elaborated on any point, you never talked about any of the issue at hand rather than sweeping generalizations.

This isn't a personal attack at all - but this is why I think this area of the forum is even more of a joke than the rest - people can't discuss their view at all. My point is I don't think your point has half a leg to stand on, and you haven't even attempted to prove that wrong. I know I bulldoze in my methodology, but all i can say is refute my angle and give substantial reason behind the counter.

This is how people actually get to solid understandings rather than dismissing or promoting a controversial action in a handful of sentences.


Weaksauce in a small packet, used to dip dollar menu nuggets in.


Using a hyperbole example of strip poker for play a game is nowhere near a reasonably equitable scenario. Ridiculous comparisons like this give no weight to any argument, they just give an illusion of an ideal support.


If you want to be taken seriously with opinions on an issue, then you'll have to do better broseph.


Or kick Brandon in the nutttttttttttttttttttttz and post pix.


Why am I being an asshole ? Because perhaps it will make you actually reconsider spouting off a view without giving reason to it. Because perhaps someday you will have influence on a kids life, I'd hate to see it be done with such blanket reasoning when that motherfucker either truly does or does not need help.

[Dogmeat]

I graduated highschool the year before columbine, and we used to write fucked up shit like that all the time ... nobody cared.

If you even try writing anything right now about anything like that you're put in a straight jacket, your home searched, injected with anti-depressant drugs, and told you have issues.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...................................

Solution or problem here?

[Mommy]

No you never elaborated on any point, you never talked about any of the issue at hand rather than sweeping generalizations.

This isn't a personal attack at all - but this is why I think this area of the forum is even more of a joke than the rest - people can't discuss their view at all. My point is I don't think your point has half a leg to stand on, and you haven't even attempted to prove that wrong. I know I bulldoze in my methodology, but all i can say is refute my angle and give substantial reason behind the counter.

This is how people actually get to solid understandings rather than dismissing or promoting a controversial action in a handful of sentences.


Weaksauce in a small packet, used to dip dollar menu nuggets in.


Using a hyperbole example of strip poker for play a game is nowhere near a reasonably equitable scenario. Ridiculous comparisons like this give no weight to any argument, they just give an illusion of an ideal support.


If you want to be taken seriously with opinions on an issue, then you'll have to do better broseph.


Or kick Brandon in the nutttttttttttttttttttttz and post pix.


Why am I being an asshole ? Because perhaps it will make you actually reconsider spouting off a view without giving reason to it. Because perhaps someday you will have influence on a kids life, I'd hate to see it be done with such blanket reasoning when that motherfucker either truly does or does not need help.

Its not my problem that you dont see the point im making. different opinions is all. plus, i generally post from work and dont have but a minute or two to make a post. I think I did an ok job at getting my point across, depsite using few words. I gave reasons. Maybe if you would step outside your own personal box of self proclaimed greatness, you would see them. I really dont see where you are saying that I havent given reasons. Its ok though *pat*.... believe it or not, I have nothing to prove to anyone on here so I dont have to explain myself dissertation style as to why I dont agree with something.

[Mommy]

Kids need to learn that their words and actions have consequences and that there are boundaries. I agree with the punishment.

I know. I can read. I went to a private Baptist school that didnt tolerate stupid shit like that. I like feeling safe at school, and I felt safe. Kids and teachers just dont feel safe anymore.

Yes, I understand and I just interpret it differently than you do.

If you tell a young child that they can play any game that they want to play...that means any game within reason. No strip poker and shit like that. In this case, the teacher wanted the students to be creative. Write anything their imagination brings to mind.... there are unsaid limits though. The student knew this. He was just trying to test boundaries. Thats cool, though, if you want to throw low blows to get your point across. I expect that from idiots like Brandon, but not from you.

I think you all are ignorant to how much a teenager knows the difference between right and wrong. Quit making this kid out to be an innocent victim. He knew what he was doing....pushing limits. Its against the law to make threats. He made a threat. Ignorance is not an excuse.

again, underestimating teenagers. yeah, analytical depth isnt their strong point, but this isnt something too deep. "hmm write anything I want? ok... ill write about killing people cuz she said ANYTHING and it will be funny to see her reaction when i write this cuz she cant do anything about it cuz she said ANYTHING." Seriously, ridiculous. Kids must know that there are consequences for their actions. The word "anything" in my opinion has always constituted an unsaid "within reason". When I was in jr high and high school, we were given writing assignments where the teacher said "anything" and none of us were stupid enough to pull shit like this. Kids will be intelligent when it is demanded of them. Quit giving kids every excuse in the book to act ignorant.

he used an out of body character so it seemed more imaginary than a statement of intent.





I just think there should be consequences.

ok well that kinda sucks. thats taking the punishment too far, but i guess they have to set the example with someone

There you go, Rocky. Just incase you didnt see everything I posted.

Oh and I think you need to use dictionary.com for the definition of "hyperbole" because there is no way that was one.

[FORSAKENR320]

There you go, Rocky. Just incase you didnt see everything I posted.

Oh and I think you need to use dictionary.com for the definition of "hyperbole" because there is no way that was one.

and you need to learn to spellcheck

[Mommy]

and you need to learn to spellcheck

"Spellcheck" is two words....nice try though

[cupcake]

found a couple quotes for jessica and the rest of the chicken littles...

"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel."
-Patrick Henry


"They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security."
-Benjamin Franklin

[Spectatrix]

All I've said regarding this incident is a blurb, so let me throw in some more detailed commentary.

I think that student writings that contain threats should be taken very seriously and do warrant investigation and possible arrest. However, by a threat I mean writings such as "I want to kill so-and-so" or "I want to blow up the school". Not "I had a dream about killing folks... lol, just kidding".

I think writings like this student's are tending towards threat status, but still does not constitute a threat. The appropriate course of action in this and similar cases is for the teacher/parents/counselor to sit down and talk to the kid, determine if something's wrong or if they were just trying to get a rise out of people, and then take appropriate action depending on that determination. If something's wrong, then obviously counseling of some sort is probably in order.

Arresting the kid and ruining his military career before it even starts is asinine.

[cupcake]

the one thing I can appreciate about this situation is if I was a teacher or a principal right now, this would not be an easy job...or task...to correctly ID the true crazies versus angsty normal kids.

but it's also something that should probably warrant more initial examination rather than the knee jerk PO-LEESE reaction that teacher and principal did.

considering the guy was a good kid and student, and had enlisted in the Marines...coupled with the fact there was obvious bad blood between him and that particular teacher (I've been there)...I highly doubt he was gonna go off and shoot up anything, and was trying to make a point to the teacher on how shittily she relates to and deals with the students (albeit his method was stupid and immature).

I just foresee this getting worse...meanwhile the killers will slip under the meek loser radar and continue on...

[Mommy]

You know what I think is really sad... that the youth of today think that Freedom of Speech gives them the right to be assholes. Our founding fathers held freedom of speech so valuable because it gave them the right to protect themselves against the government. They had the right to say they didnt agree with certain laws, elected officials, etc. I think had they known what some of the dumbass youth of today would be saying, they would have worded it quite differently. Yes, we have the right to say how stupid laws are. Yes, we have the right to say our elected officials are fucking stupid and list reasons why. Do you honestly think that your freedom of speech should interupt another's pursuit of happiness?

On a completely different note: CNN did not give all the information on that story. When I read the CNN story, I was like wow.... arrest this kid. When I read the whole paper the kid wrote, it wasnt nearly as bad. He sounded like he was actually trying to make a statement (a legitimate use of freedom of speech, although he could have made his point in a different way) and not making a statement of fucked up thoughts that he has had (which is something that should be kept to yourself).

I guess this is me just saying random ass statements again, though, and not backing up anything that I say despite giving clear reasons as to why I feel that way. I think its awesome that I was pinpointed for not giving reasons as to why I feel the way I do, but those certain people failed to give a reasonable explanation themselves. Its cool though. As stated before, very few of you give me a reason to respect your opinion. Im sure a lot of you feel the same about me.

[cupcake]

wtf???

[Mommy]

wtf???

not talking about you.

[Divergent Realit...]

wtf???

[Mommy]

wtf....wtf???

[Divergent Realit...]

i guess that means its about time for someone to post a picture of their penis...

[Mommy]

1....2...3....NOT IT

[James]

Ok.

http://webpages.acs.ttu.edu/jpigg/images/carb.mom.jpg (NSFW)

This post has been edited by Spectatrix: May 1 2007, 01:23 PM

[FORSAKENR320]

"Spellcheck" is two words....nice try though

Spellcheck is one word. it's a program. yes, needs to be capitalized, but not 2 words

like "you need to learn how to use Google"




and as for freedom of speech.... the way people are trying to make it, it will be "you have the right to freedom of speech...as long as you don't offend me" which is bullshit. my grandmother used to say "you can't walk through the crowded room of life without stepping on a few toes" there is no way to make everyone happy, someone is always going to be pissed at what you say. it's not the individuals fault that the world has forgotten that with the freedom of speech comes the right to be offended. these old fucks with their blue hair and cackling like chickens to each other during their bingo sessions, saying "well i never!" at everything, talkin' 'bout don't do school, eat your milk, get at least 8 hours of drugs a day, jibba jabba people just need to suck it up and get over it.
/rant

[Mommy]

Im not all PC about stuff. I dont care about offensive material... unless you are making threats or are saying crazy things like you dream of killing people because it would be funny. There's a line. Just because most of you are still in your teenage mindset and dont want to accept that doesnt mean it doesnt exist.

[The Fanatic]

There is a limit to everything.

[Divergent Realit...]

Ok.

http://webpages.acs.ttu.edu/jpigg/images/carb.mom.jpg (NSFW)

how is that nsfw?

you cant see anything.

[James]

how is that nsfw?

you cant see anything.

QFT. Pretty sure my boss even showed that to me at work once upon a time. Cept it was on a card, not on his computer.

[Spectatrix]

how is that nsfw?

you cant see anything.

It's a large pic and it doesn't leave much to the imagination. It most certainly is not a pic I want to have come up at work, so I edited it. Besides, this is NPR, for cryin' out loud. This is probably the forum where people *least* expect to see something risque.