Wow. Free schooling..., Where was this when I started?? Options

[James]

This sucks. I had to pay for my education, so they should have to pay for their education! I certainly don't want to pay for their education.

Anyway, you might as well advise any younger siblings you might have if they qualify.

------------------------------------------------

Texas Tech University Announces Guaranteed Tuition Program

In an effort to increase access to higher education, Texas Tech University System Chancellor Kent Hance Monday (Feb. 12) announced a plan to offer free tuition and mandatory fees to some Texans.

During testimony Monday (Feb. 12) before the Texas House of Representatives Higher Education Committee, Hance announced a plan that would guarantee 100 percent of tuition and mandatory fees for the average course load for all new freshman students from Texas whose family’s adjusted gross income does not exceed $40,000. The plan will go into effect for the fall 2007 semester.

“Texas Tech is committed to providing higher education opportunities for financially disadvantaged Texans,” said Hance. “It is vital that we find ways to make college affordable for as many Texans as possible. The state’s future depends on a well-educated population.”

“We will pay for eight semesters of higher education, the time it typically takes to complete a degree,” said Texas Tech University President Jon Whitmore. “This means that many students who did not think they could afford college now can. A degree from Texas Tech means a brighter economic future for these students and for our state.”

The Red Raider Guarantee program is available to first-time freshman students who are Texas residents and who enroll as full time students each semester. Students must also be eligible for federal financial aid. Eligible students who complete and submit the Free Application for Federal Student Aid (FAFSA) form before May 1, 2007, are guaranteed to receive funds. Any applications received after May 1, 2007 will be awarded based on available funding. Students may qualify for the program for up to eight semesters of full-time enrollment.

Texas Tech students who are enrolled in 15 credit hours per semester currently pay $6,800 in tuition and mandatory fees per year. Under the new program, tuition and mandatory fees will be paid by a combination of federal, state and institutional funds.

Eligible students are encouraged to learn more at www.redraiderguarantee.ttu.edu.

[impala454]

wow

[GOB]

nice try, but the middle-class gets fucked again.

i'll never support programs like this.

[impala454]

nice try, but the middle-class gets fucked again.

i'll never support programs like this.

how does the middle-class get fucked exactly?

[James]

Because it's just below the income bracket for middle class and the middle class usually have a very difficult time coming up with the money to pay for college since they're not making the big bucks, putting them into a lot of debt.

And don't think you have a choice in supporting it or not. As long as you buy things from the store and hold a job, you're paying sales tax and federal income tax, both of which are funding this program.

[Aaron]

Because it's just below the income bracket for middle class and the middle class usually have a very difficult time coming up with the money to pay for college since they're not making the big bucks, putting them into a lot of debt.

And don't think you have a choice in supporting it or not. As long as you buy things from the store and hold a job, you're paying sales tax and federal income tax, both of which are funding this program.

QFT.

[GOB]

i was going to specify my previous post by saying "upper-middle class," the segment that is constantly taking it in every hole.

not going to respond to impala's comment because it would just draw out another string of questions, no matter how clearly something is presented.

[Spectatrix]

Yep, middle class gets fucked. Not eligible for this, not eligible for the "need-based" scholarships out there, often not eligible for financial aid for one reason or another (like my mom being "land rich", but otherwise poor as shit). Totally fucked.

[impala454]

you guys aren't thinking about this at all.

before this proposal: AGI > 40k has to pay for school
after this proposal: AGI > 40k has to pay for school

how exactly does AGI > 40k "get fucked". nothing at all changes for them. what it does is help all the AGI < 40k. did it ever occur to you jackasses that maybe the state can't afford to pay for that number of people, and that this is freaking awesome that they're doing it at all? way to be a bunch of selfish pricks. "waaah this doesn't help me bc my parents make 80k!!!"

[James]

Damn right I'm selfish. I'd rather my money go to myself and family to better ourselves than someone that I don't even know or care about and will never be able to see the results of my generous donation. The state of Texas has a very messed up view of how to improve our economy. They think by putting everyone into college, more money will magically appear in our state, but college does not yield vast income all of the time. This view is the same reason they're requiring four years of math and science out of high school students now instead of the three we took. They think there's a shortage of engineers and want to get more people interested in those fields.

[impala454]

Damn right I'm selfish. I'd rather my money go to myself and family to better ourselves than someone that I don't even know or care about and will never be able to see the results of my generous donation. The state of Texas has a very messed up view of how to improve our economy. They think by putting everyone into college, more money will magically appear in our state, but college does not yield vast income all of the time. This view is the same reason they're requiring four years of math and science out of high school students now instead of the three we took. They think there's a shortage of engineers and want to get more people interested in those fields.

so how would your views change on texas wasting taxpayer money to put everyone through school if they ratcheted this program up to AGI < 60k? or even 80k?

[GOB]

my parents make $80k a year? that's news to me. i guess all those loans i took out were play money and i don't have to pay them back... not that paying them back should be a problem after using them to get a college education and a well-paying job. hmm, maybe that's the point of student loans-- to assist those in need while they need it and to be repaid at a later date.

this proposal is nothing different than welfare, but for people in better financial situations.

on a completely different note, i'm going to give everybody on this board $80,000 spread out over four years, but impala doesn't get anything. in fact, i'm going to take money from his taxes to pay you guys. that's totally not fucking him, just to be clear.

[James]

so how would your views change on texas wasting taxpayer money to put everyone through school if they ratcheted this program up to AGI > 60k? or even 80k?

Still against it. It's a waste of tax payer money. There are plenty of other financial resources available to fund your education; they're called loans. Borrow the money now, use your education to get a job, and repay the loan with the job that your education helped you get. I know, silly concept. Who would've thought of that!

[Billy]

The number of people from families that make that little money that go to college is generally pretty small. And even though you think you'll never benefit from the fruits of a better educated society, I think you're wrong, and I support this.

[Mommy]

you guys aren't thinking about this at all.

before this proposal: AGI > 40k has to pay for school
after this proposal: AGI > 40k has to pay for school

how exactly does AGI > 40k "get fucked". nothing at all changes for them. what it does is help all the AGI < 40k. did it ever occur to you jackasses that maybe the state can't afford to pay for that number of people, and that this is freaking awesome that they're doing it at all? way to be a bunch of selfish pricks. "waaah this doesn't help me bc my parents make 80k!!!"

my parents make 105k a year, but werent able to pay for my school because I have a brother with autism and epilepsy. even with health insurance my parents fork out a lot of money for him... A LOT. FAFSA leaves no room to take into account special medical circumstances. I love how I have never been eligible for grants or work study yet Im left to pay for everything. I dont care. It will be funny if I die single and the govt is left to pay for all my education.... all 80k of it.

[Rocky]

Y'all are acting like such bitches.


This idea does not "fuck" the middle class or anybody -

It offers opportunity to people in a lower financial bracket. And from that article, it seems that these people still have to be admitted into Tech. Granted it isn't exactly hard to get into Tech - but still, the point is it isn't just handing a free education to everybody in a poor family.


The point is, giving somebody an advantage does not imply those who don't get the advantage are automatically fucked.

[Spectatrix]

The point is, giving somebody an advantage does not imply those who don't get the advantage are automatically fucked.

It's hard to get excited about paying taxes (or higher tuition, depending on where the money's coming from) for somebody else's kid to get an education. I know we already do, but shit.

[Billy]

It's hard to get excited about paying taxes (or higher tuition, depending on where the money's coming from) for somebody else's kid to get an education. I know we already do, but shit.

I know you will never agree with this, especially without hard data, but in my opinion, you'd never be able to make the amount of money you do make without the lower class being as 'fucked' as they already are. Capitalism is a pyramid. There must be a lot more lower class supporting the higher ones.

[Rocky]

It's hard to get excited about paying taxes (or higher tuition, depending on where the money's coming from) for somebody else's kid to get an education. I know we already do, but shit.

I absolutely guarantee that I could personally list off millions of dollars I get to see being wasted of taxpayers money already.



These kids, if they graduate and go get a job with their degree, will at the least be then paying more taxes and pumping more money into the economy than had they never got a degree (in general).

[Testm0nkey]

i agree with billy. i think its a pretty logical idea

i agree with rockys post as well.

but i do agree it is hard for the true middle class to pay for college due to the way most scholarship/grant programs are run


too much headache to further my points

[Testm0nkey]

BUT i was just reminded how dumb people are with their grants, loans and scholarships. you dont get the right to complain about being in debt if you go "yay scholarship monies in i can buy that ___"
way too many people do that. thats what screws you up financially

[Spectatrix]

I absolutely guarantee that I could personally list off millions of dollars I get to see being wasted of taxpayers money already.
These kids, if they graduate and go get a job with their degree, will at the least be then paying more taxes and pumping more money into the economy than had they never got a degree (in general).

Granted, I do view this as less of a waste than most other programs. *shrugs*

[TetraGrammaton C...]

40k, heh, that is what they pay the assistant professors.

[Testm0nkey]

so is it assistant professor -> associate professor -> tenure?

and assistant professor arent exclusively just phd canidates?
because i heard the pay was much higher than that but for associate professors

[TetraGrammaton C...]

yeah, after a couple of years they offer you an associate professorship if you stay on the tenure track. by the end of 6 years (for most departments) if you have completed all your tenure requirements you are given tenure. if you have not, you have 12 months to find another job.

as for pay, i think the general pay levels are around 5-10 grand apart for each level. tech has a merit system though, so the more crap you do the more of a raise you get. i think it is usually only a 2% wage increase. (no cost of living wage increase and no bonuses at tech)

[GOB]

yeah, the tech wage inflation rate is really low. the TRS benefits are pretty nice, though.

[The Fanatic]

Too little too late ass hats, but i do support it. I would qualify if I was an incoming freshmen



The next step should be free education for EVERYONE

This post has been edited by Dr. Gonzo: Feb 14 2007, 01:17 AM

[theIncredibleEdi...]

This only annoys me because I am buried in loans because my mother makes less than $20,000 a year, and my father fled to the US Virgin Islands so he could escape paying child support and helping with school.

I agree with Gonzo...it is too little, too late. All we can do is be glad for future students who will get an opportunity that they may not have been able to before. While I wish this kinda stuff had come around in time for me to take advantage, it's in the past....all I can do is work with the cards I was dealt.

[impala454]

It's hard to get excited about paying taxes (or higher tuition, depending on where the money's coming from) for somebody else's kid to get an education. I know we already do, but shit.

well get used to it. in the real world you'll pay taxes for all kinds of shit you don't use (including other people's kids). I sure as hell don't remember getting much out of the $1,000 I paid to LISD last year from my property taxes.

[impala454]

on a completely different note, i'm going to give everybody on this board $80,000 spread out over four years, but impala doesn't get anything. in fact, i'm going to take money from his taxes to pay you guys. that's totally not fucking him, just to be clear.

I'm glad you finally figured it out

honestly you guys are seriously just crying because you're not getting the free tuition.

[False Dude]

maybe more schools will do this therefore when our offspring go to college we wont be forking over 50k

-Testm0

[impala454]

shit by the time any of us have offspring in college it'll be more like 200k

[False Dude]

i dont think that much. itll keep getting more expensive but i think we'd see more things like this happening

[impala454]

well at the rate they're going... I know my tuition doubled from my freshman year -> graduation (granted, was six years ) but still.

[Spectatrix]

honestly you guys are seriously just crying because you're not getting the free tuition.

I don't know about the rest of the people here, but that's not the case with me. I often oppose legislation even when it would benefit me.

My view on this is that it should be basically all or nothing. Either pay for everyone's post-secondary education (will all the same old admission requirements, of course) or don't pay for any of it. Fuck this middle ground bullshit.

[impala454]

well I think it's fairly obvious that the govt can't afford to pay for everyone's college.

[Spectatrix]

Europe does it, why can't we?

[The Fanatic]

We like having relatively low taxes and a military

[Mommy]

IMy view on this is that it should be basically all or nothing. Either pay for everyone's post-secondary education (will all the same old admission requirements, of course) or don't pay for any of it. Fuck this middle ground bullshit.

I absolutely agree with this right here. Just because someone's PARENTS have money, doesnt mean that the parents will give it to them for college. If we want an educated society, it should be free university education for everyone. Maybe if the gov't was footing the bill, the school wouldnt waste money on stupid shit like repainting the cop cars a different color.

We like having relatively low taxes and a military

relatively low taxes? Ummm no

[Mommy]

of course, there is a disadvantage to a free education.... it will mean that a graduate degree will be ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY to get ahead in the job market.

[Spectatrix]

of course, there is a disadvantage to a free education.... it will mean that a graduate degree will be ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY to get ahead in the job market.

Yay, I'm ahead of the curve!

[Mommy]

for now... unless grad school is made available for free to poor people... then youre just another idiot in the crowd

[Spectatrix]

Yeah, there's no reason for that. Grad school is already free most of the time with the availability of research and teaching assistantships. I paid for books and a few fees, but that was about it.

[jwttu]

i read in the AJ that they eventually are looking to increase this to 100k and lower

[Rocky]

Uhh

Y"all who are talking about Europe, go look at their income tax rates and get back to this thread.

[woody]

FA use to give me a check for $500 every semester.

I don't know why this was done, I never applied for anything outside FASFA and loans.

I'll only approve of this program if those who use this "free" tutition under one condition.
if you don't graduate within 4 years you owe the money back that the university gave you

if your getting free college your ass better work for it

[Billy]

FA use to give me a check for $500 every semester.

I don't know why this was done, I never applied for anything outside FASFA and loans.

I'll only approve of this program if those who use this "free" tutition under one condition.
if you don't graduate within 4 years you owe the money back that the university gave you

if your getting free college your ass better work for it

What if you get two degrees?

Or what if you find your calling and suddenly begin to excel two years into college?

Or how about a severe illness in the family?

There are any number of reasons why someone wouldn't graduate in 4 years. And that's why financial aid currently has someone who judges those situations and decides whether or not you qualify for financial aid. I think the same system should be used in the future.

[TetraGrammaton C...]

Uhh

Y"all who are talking about Europe, go look at their income tax rates and get back to this thread.

let's not generalize europe

[The Fanatic]

I
relatively low taxes? Ummm no

Ummm yes.

Compare our taxes to western nations what have unviersal health care and education for all citizens...

[Spectatrix]

Uhh

Y"all who are talking about Europe, go look at their income tax rates and get back to this thread.

I'm well aware that their tax rates are atrocious. I would rather have low taxes and not have publicly-funded education, health care, etc. But if we're going to provide such services for a segment of the population, I damn well think we should be providing them for all.

We wanna make it easier for folks to get a college education? Fine, make more money available for federal loans, give tax breaks to organizations that provide scholarships. Get rid of the grants and other federal/state "free money". Cut administrative bloat and ramp up alumni fundraising so that tuition costs aren't so damn high in the first place.

[Jim]

I'm well aware that their tax rates are atrocious. I would rather have low taxes and not have publicly-funded education, health care, etc. But if we're going to provide such services for a segment of the population, I damn well think we should be providing them for all.

We wanna make it easier for folks to get a college education? Fine, make more money available for federal loans, give tax breaks to organizations that provide scholarships. Get rid of the grants and other federal/state "free money". Cut administrative bloat and ramp up alumni fundraising so that tuition costs aren't so damn high in the first place.

Hear hear!

[Mommy]

I havent done much research, but the lower income bracket in America does have lower tax rates than Europe, but what about the upper bracket income? They are taxed upwards of 40%. Either way, I would rather have higher taxes and govt funded education and healthcare.

[impala454]

Just because someone's PARENTS have money, doesnt mean that the parents will give it to them for college.

take a closer look, I don't see the word "parents" anywhere. it's your family's AGI as indicated by your latest tax documents. if you're a dependent then yeah the person who listed you as a dependent's income will be included. if you declare yourself independent, it's your income and yours only. I believe you can declare yourself independent at 18, but most parents wouldn't want you to because of the $2000 (i think) hope tax credit they receieve. If you can get free tuition though I think most parents & kids who have half a brain would forego that tax credit. It's your decision whether or not to declare independent though, not your parents.

relatively low taxes? Ummm no

the word "relatively" indicates that he was saying we have low taxes relative to europe, which we do by far. if you don't like taxes here, you sure as hell better not move over there (or praise their tax money funded programs over ours).

[Mommy]

take a closer look, I don't see the word "parents" anywhere. it's your family's AGI as indicated by your latest tax documents. if you're a dependent then yeah the person who listed you as a dependent's income will be included. if you declare yourself independent, it's your income and yours only. I believe you can declare yourself independent at 18, but most parents wouldn't want you to because of the $2000 (i think) hope tax credit they receieve. If you can get free tuition though I think most parents & kids who have half a brain would forego that tax credit. It's your decision whether or not to declare independent though, not your parents.


the word "relatively" indicates that he was saying we have low taxes relative to europe, which we do by far. if you don't like taxes here, you sure as hell better not move over there (or praise their tax money funded programs over ours).

Youre an idiot if you think you can declare yourself as independent at 18. Im 21 and I still cant even though my parents dont give me SHIT. Here is the list of ways you can declare yourself as independent before age 23:
1) join the military
2) get knocked up or have a dependent
3) get married
4) get a signed affidavite claiming that you no longer have ANY CONTACT AT ALL with your parents. Relatives and friends of the family have to submit statements as well.
5) Have at least one dead parent

Believe me, I went round and round on this one with financial aid here at UT. Additionally, I finally decided to do some research regarding FAFSA and found out those are the only ways.

[Mommy]

Raise your hand if you have lived in Europe

[Seussninja]

You'll be payin taxes anyways, might as well get used to it. You people can bitch and moan all you want but ultimately it won't effect the decision they make. The day politicians listen to their constituents is the day a toddler pays attention to "The Seventh Seal" the whole way through.

[Mommy]

i seriously would love to move to another country. im not saying that another country has better laws, but America claims to have the best govt and its shitty. I would rather live somewhere that doesnt claim that title.

[Seussninja]

i seriously would love to move to another country. im not saying that another country has better laws, but America claims to have the best govt and its shitty. I would rather live somewhere that doesnt claim that title.

You have to pick somewhere you know you'll enjoy the laws and regulations because its just as difficult to get anything accomplished in any other governmental system on this planet.

[impala454]

Youre an idiot if you think you can declare yourself as independent at 18. Im 21 and I still cant even though my parents dont give me SHIT. Here is the list of ways you can declare yourself as independent before age 23:
1) join the military
2) get knocked up or have a dependent
3) get married
4) get a signed affidavite claiming that you no longer have ANY CONTACT AT ALL with your parents. Relatives and friends of the family have to submit statements as well.
5) Have at least one dead parent

Believe me, I went round and round on this one with financial aid here at UT. Additionally, I finally decided to do some research regarding FAFSA and found out those are the only ways.

I just didn't recall the correct age, excuse me. so if you want the free tuition under this program, the solution seems pretty simple. go to college when you're 23, or do one of the 5 things in your list (although the military will pay for your school anyhow).

it's still funny to me that you guys are crying about this so much. take the damn loans and leave it at that. we're talking about something that's the price of a nice car, at a 2-3% interest rate, spread over like 20 years.

Jessica, if your parents are so terrible that they never helped you, paid for anything, or whatever, I'm so sorry. From what you've said here it sounds like they booted you out the door after high school graduation without so much as a bus ticket. There's far more to paying for college than just the tuition, and a family income of less than $40,000 leaves little room for those things. Things like having a car, car insurance, medical insurance, living expenses, books, clothes, etc. Not having to worry about tuition means that financial aid can encompass more of those expenses. I haven't seen the numbers lately, but my tuition doubled from my freshman to my senior year, while the loan amounts remained the same. I actually ended up taking extra non-stafford loans to cover living expenses.

[Spectatrix]

Youre an idiot if you think you can declare yourself as independent at 18. Im 21 and I still cant even though my parents dont give me SHIT. Here is the list of ways you can declare yourself as independent before age 23:
1) join the military
2) get knocked up or have a dependent
3) get married
4) get a signed affidavite claiming that you no longer have ANY CONTACT AT ALL with your parents. Relatives and friends of the family have to submit statements as well.
5) Have at least one dead parent

Believe me, I went round and round on this one with financial aid here at UT. Additionally, I finally decided to do some research regarding FAFSA and found out those are the only ways.

Wow, looks like there are far different standards for independence as far as the IRS and FAFSA folks are concerned. For the IRS, you simply have to be providing 50% or more of the money for your living expenses.

[Mommy]

Wow, looks like there are far different standards for independence as far as the IRS and FAFSA folks are concerned. For the IRS, you simply have to be providing 50% or more of the money for your living expenses.

no shit. AND this is funny: for healthy insurance, parents cannot carry you on their insurance after your 22nd bday.... OH WAIT BUT NOOOOOO youre still dependent for financial aid until you are 23... its complete bullshit

[Testm0nkey]

Raise your hand if you have lived in Europe

::raises hand::

[Divergent Realit...]

no shit. AND this is funny: for healthy insurance, parents cannot carry you on their insurance after your 22nd bday.... OH WAIT BUT NOOOOOO youre still dependent for financial aid until you are 23... its complete bullshit

depends on the carrier.

i was covered until i turned 25.

edit: humana through the school district

[Spectatrix]

Yeah, depends on the insurance. I'm covered until I'm 23 on both insurances I'm on.

[Mommy]

fuck Federal Blue Cross Blue Shield... either that or fuck my parents for lying to me that im getting dropped in less than a month. I think Im supposed to be carried until im 23

[The Fanatic]

I'm well aware that their tax rates are atrocious. I would rather have low taxes and not have publicly-funded education, health care, etc. But if we're going to provide such services for a segment of the population, I damn well think we should be providing them for all.

We wanna make it easier for folks to get a college education? Fine, make more money available for federal loans, give tax breaks to organizations that provide scholarships. Get rid of the grants and other federal/state "free money". Cut administrative bloat and ramp up alumni fundraising so that tuition costs aren't so damn high in the first place.

I dont think we should get rid of Grants, then again I directly benefit from them...